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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

A collective of people engaged in pretty much what the name suggests
Winner of the 75nd Attention-Hungry Games
/caco/ - Azarath Metrion Zinthos

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Tags: leftism (CLICK HERE FOR MORE LEFTIST 8CHAN BOARDS), politics, activism, news

File: 8b15408dc4ed305⋯.jpg (114.83 KB, 1080x1414, 540:707, IMG-20190118-WA0000.jpg)

 No.2860211

Previous thread- >>2838096

Brexit potentially delayed,

Elections in NI for council in may,

Potentially EU elections after.

Where's the RA when you need them most?

 No.2860212

>>2860211

>Brexit potentially delayed

Please I just want out, I don't care what deal this is going on too long


 No.2860214

>>2860212

I hear you, a large part of me really wants to see what happens with a no-deal scenario. I'm in Belfast so I imagine utter Fucking chaos here :L


 No.2860218

Honestly, the EU elections being a thing are gonna piss off a lot of brexiteers.


 No.2860219

>>2860211

sums the cunt up nicely

finally i agree with europe!

good job we don't have guns……..


 No.2860220

File: 3aaa4da4763c572⋯.png (403.08 KB, 1185x584, 1185:584, ClipboardImage.png)


 No.2860221

>>2860214

we will always look after loyal friends


 No.2860226

can't tell if europhiles using the cook islands flag on twitter is #FBPE bullshittery (look, it's got the british flag AND a circle of stars! it MUST be fit for my appropriation) or just like two people who've actually been to/got relation to the small nation in the realm of new zealand that i've correlated into a trend based on paranoia and a bitterness that i'm stuck with the UK.


 No.2860231

Dutchie here. Are any of you aware of the capital flight that the British bourgeoisie is undertaking? Amsterdam might replace London as the centre of finance.


 No.2860235

>>2860220

wait does this mean that most of those UKIP voters are projected to vote labour now?


 No.2860236

>>2860235

Some of them yeah, this is what happened in 2017.


 No.2860237

>>2860231

Amsterdam will replace London as the centre of finance when Amsterdam becomes a weird city-state where you can legally launder mondey because you have Aldermen elected by companies. Until then, nah.

There is some capital flight mind, but it's mostly going to Dublin.


 No.2860239

Does everyone on /leftypol/ share the same hatred for white women as /pol/? Genuine question. Apologies if I’ve offended anyone.


 No.2860242

>>2860239

No, but not sure what this has to do with british politics…


 No.2860244

>>2860242

It has to do with everything.


 No.2860246

>>2860244

then put it in the internet shit thread.


 No.2860248

>>2860237

>a weird city-state where you can legally launder mondey because you have Aldermen elected by companies

sounds like Amsterdam really


 No.2860249

>>2860248

Except the City of London literally is that. It's not an accident it become the financial capital of Europe, it is due to its unique governmental system.


 No.2860257

>>2860235

>>2860236 (me)

Also should be noted that some of them are Green protest votes that are repatriating.


 No.2860262

>Proposed repeal. The Conservative Party manifesto at the 2017 general election proposed repealing the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011. To do so would require a new Act of Parliament.

hey finally a tory policy i unironically agree with 100%

friendship ended with reheated social democracy now blairism is my new friend


 No.2860271

>>2860235

Nah a lot probably went to Brexit probably. Honestly susprised to see Brexit and UKIP in different European groups


 No.2860277

>>2860271

Well nUKIP and BXT are basically the two wings of modern right-wing populism: the ethnonationalist and civic nationalist branches. Hence the Civic Nat branch goes into EFDD, and likely into ECR after the EU elections, and the Ethnonat lot joins the ENF.


 No.2860280

File: f0e078f99d7fc7c⋯.png (1.71 MB, 1046x1152, 523:576, ClipboardImage.png)

Tbh, can't wait for Punished Miliband to enter into a socialist Labour Cabinet. Would make a good foreign sec tbh.


 No.2860281

>>2860212

>>2860214

They'll make it as hard as they can if we get a hard Brexit (unlikely as it is) because otherwise it will encourage others

>>2860237

I can't see the City of London allowing that to any great degree. They have the privilege of being a city state which is extremely attractive to financiers and has been exploited for hundreds of years. In fact, they may flourish again because they will be free of some of the EU's restrictions


 No.2860287

sometimes i wonder if the problem with this country is that nobody ever leaves the mindset of half-arsing things for uni.

the half-arsing government minister reads his half-arsed policy document cited from sources the author knows are unreliable but easier to churn out text to than searching for the truth, the same approach those sources took with their sources, and so on and so on until whatever point on the past people used to actually care and try.

and then, naturally, i cite the same half-arsed policy documents in my 2 days late essay, telling myself i'll never do it again. and of course i won't. not until the next time.


 No.2860288

>>2860220

kinda surprised the UKIP voters mostly went to Labour.

I hope this happens just to make Brexiteers panic and spook May hardcore


 No.2860289

>>2860220

So they're calling themselves ChUK, not CUK? Has that unbelievable egotist named the party after himself?


 No.2860291

>>2860289

ChUK's suck'n'fuck

formerly: The SDP/Liberal Alliance


 No.2860292

>>2860288

That's not quite the movement (beware seeing shrinking bars and growing bars and thinking they are direct links) but still.

Also apparently Labour would put the S&D into the role of EU president: unironically Corbyn could cuck Juncker the geriatric cunt.

>>2860289

Nah that's just what UK elects calls them.

>>2860291

Please, the SDP were to the left of Blair and had principles.


 No.2860301

>>2860006

>A confirmatory referendum is the 'right' (moral, democratic) thing to do

Why is it that Leave has to win several times in order to be implemented, but Remain only has to win once? Why is no-deal to be kept off the ballot paper, even though it's the most popular form of Brexit? Why even have Remain on the ballot paper, when it's already been rejected? It would be far more democratic to have a simple run-off between the various forms of Brexit. And this isn't even bringing up the obvious bad faith of this stuff being put forward by people who never wanted the 2016 referendum to start with and only want a referendum now so they can reverse the first one. I presume that none of them would agree to a third referendum if Remain wins the second one, even though the public may of course change their mind again.


 No.2860307

>>2860301

>Why is it that Leave has to win several times in order to be implemented, but Remain only has to win once?

this isn't strictly true though. if remain wins again, those in favour of leaving are free to campaign for a third referendum. at some point you hit a sense of fatigue or approach self-parody, but it's not like losing a second independence referendum would kill the SNP forever either.

there's something about real political power lurking in this analysis tbh. the sort of intertia and balance of forces at play that reveal the really relevant thing isn't murmuring about the ethics of holding votes.


 No.2860312

>>2860307

>those in favour of leaving are free to campaign for a third referendum

Yeah but if they were consistent, People's Voters would be fine with a third referendum in another few years, to check that the people still wanted to remain in the EU. In reality they would be aghast. They pretty much expect Leave voters to shut up and fuck off once the second referendum produces the correct result (in fact they're gleefully looking forward to this)..


 No.2860355

IMO from a pragmatic standpoint it may be best that Corbyn offers a second ref, but only if it is on his version of Brexit. This is purely because passing anything, be it a hard, soft, or no brexit through parliament, will be pretty controversial and damaging. However saying "We want this deal, we are willing to put it to the public for ascension" is more sound politically, and also you can frame it as "this deal or something else", not necessarily "this deal vs remain".

Still, that's just my opinion. Should be noted that such a confirmatory referendum would not be out-of-place in most European countries.


 No.2860356

>>2860277

I respect EFDD far more than ENF due to former being the most vehemently resistant to Article 13. ENF is honestly just upset that EU is fucking things up their way.


 No.2860357

>>2860356

Tbf the EFDD is mostly a meme at this point: both the AfD and M5S are leaving to found their own groups.


 No.2860360

>>2860357

Well it was fun while it lasted. EFDD was the only group that wanted EU to crash and burn.


 No.2860363

>>2860360

Well a load of the EFDD members are going with M5S to form their own meme syncratic soft eurosceptic group so that could be funny.


 No.2860364

>>2860288

Seems unlikely. I live in a Labour stronghold but everyone I know, including myself, intends to vote UKIP if we are dragged into an EU election.


 No.2860369

Is this peak Guardian? Under the irony it's basically just calling Leave voters racist scum.

https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2019/apr/10/militias-chaos-starvation-britain-10-years-after-brexit-jonathan-meades

>>2860355

>also you can frame it as "this deal or something else", not necessarily "this deal vs remain".

Labour is being run by the People's Vote crowd now and they all want Remain or bust. That's why they always say 'with Remain on the ballot paper' whenever they refer to a second referendum. IIRC the left of the party has discussed having a referendum without Remain or a referendum with multiple Leave options, but it's never got anywhere. Corbyn is doing a good job of stalling but ultimately he's signed up to Starmer's 'six tests' which make any possible deal unacceptable to Labour and therefore oblige Labour to back Remain.


 No.2860372

>>2860369

Just put more options on the ballot, so nothing gets 50%+1 vote


 No.2860385

>>2860292

shouldn't have said mostly as Im not some brainlet who doesn't realize its not direct transfers 100% of the time. but even considering shifts from say the tories to labour like 5-9% of UKIPs loss went back to Labour, which Im still surprised by.


 No.2860515

Is there any economically left wing ideology that not only allows old fashioned social views but actively encourages them?


 No.2860527

>>2860515

There's Blue Labour or the SDP party if you want Left Wing economics and actually reactionary/communitarian views. But for ideology I guess S.trasserism might apply?


 No.2860539

>>2860527

Strasserism might a good option. I like their views on jews. I'll have to do more research before I embrace it though. The SDP might be ok as well. Perhaps a bit too centrist on economics and they don't really go far enough on the immigration issue. Give me some examples of Blue Labour? I recently heard of Eddie Dempsey and watched his speech at the Labour Leave conference and he seems a decent lad. The issue with anything Labour is having to associate with cunts. Most Labour voters I know are good people but the party membership and especially the MPs are cancer.


 No.2860549

>>2860539

If you're interested in Blue Labour, they have their own website with info about them plus they have some stuff on social media. I'm sure with some searching around you can find the PDFs of their books. Also yeah Labour has an infestation of Blairite and FBPE melts, I wish they'd leave for the Lib Dems or CUKs


 No.2860555

>>2860385

Oh, that's what happened in 2017 tbh.

>>2860515

Blue Labour, here's a primer:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Labour


 No.2860556

>>2860539

Yeah the issue with the party membership is that it is made of activists, while the new intake under Corbyn was mostly working class there was a large number of returners. If I were Labour party gen sec I would push for safe seat voters and trade union members to join wholesale.


 No.2860662

They've just agreed to extend Brexit again until 31st October, with every extension you already know parliament is getting closer and closer to revoking article 50. The melts at r/ukpolitics aren't even hiding their intentions


 No.2860666

>>2860662

Should be noted that the UK can leave when it wants, the extension is about the hard cap at the end.


 No.2860671

>>2860666

They're just going to extend brexit, and due to this Theresa May has an excuse to keep being around for fucking ever, because it's "an emergency".


 No.2860674

>>2860549

>>2860555

>>2860556

Thanks lads. They seem like an appropriate group for me but i'll certainly need to read more. Easier said than done after working a nine hours and fulfilling social obligations/responsibilities but i'll find the time. I live in a safe Labour constituency but i'm not a big fan of the MP. She isn't going with the FPBE types for fear of the Leave majority but is a Blairite at heart. The local activists are definitely an issue. I'd love to see a return to a working class membership.


 No.2860692

>>2860539

>old fashioned social views

>>2860539

>Strasserism might a good option. I like their views on jews.

why not just say racism, antisemitism and homophobia


 No.2860736

Wtf Scargill is still alive?


 No.2860770

In 2469 the sentient program eMay and its robovessel, full emissaries of the British caliphate wielding power both temporal and spiritual arrive into nuBXL, capital of the European Transunion. In the background holographic fireworks celebrate the 450th anniversary of Br3xit.

D0nald T3sk XXVII "the debonair", sublime chairman of the Transunion and his loyal mandarin Cybarnier recieve them in the palace of hard light, the jewel of Neoversailles. Solemnly eMay is granted another year's extension to the Br3xit process. As it was, is and forever shall be.


 No.2860866

Congratulation, Corbyn you fat dyke. Everyone really wished for a second referendum.


 No.2860903

WHO'S HYPED FOR HALLOWEEN BREXIT???


 No.2860907

Brits are faggy as fuck, I really don't feel bad about this fucking the pommy cunts over


 No.2860929

>>2860907

the only thing i want in life is to be an australian or new zealander tbh

lie awake at night with paranoid daydreams of doing all the paperwork and losing my accent only to still be rejected for the one thing i can't manipulate: birthplace. nightmares of naturalisation as a door that closed to those born after say the 80s unless they moved over as children.

nightmare scenario.


 No.2860934

Well Assange has been arrested, apparently the Ecuadorean embassy invited the MET in.


 No.2860937


 No.2860942

File: 127d4e0635af70b⋯.jpeg (110 KB, 640x640, 1:1, 3A01F70A-6306-4076-947D-B….jpeg)

>>2860692

Why use your enemies language?


 No.2860951

>>2860929

Mate if you're young and you have some sort of degree the Aussies will let you in faster than you can say "skin cancer at 35".


 No.2860952

>>2860934

Here's betting he doesn't get extradited.


 No.2861001

>>2860952

Foreign Sec has confirmed this is on behalf of the fucking yanks.


 No.2861002

>>2861001

RRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE


 No.2861045

So is the People's Vote finally kill, thanks to the briefness of this extension? Or would we be able to get yet another extension if it was to give time for a referendum?


 No.2861051

>>2861045

Nah, this extension gives just enough time for a second referendum. But the movement itself is kill tbh.


 No.2861052

>>2860942

If you truly were a communist first you'd be able to show solidarity with people you dislike or hate because that is how you make gains politically. I personally don't give a shit if you are a racist, sexist or whatever but if you bring that shit out into the open and allow it to colour your communist praxis then me and many others are damn sure going to resist you. The fact that you're looking to ingratiate yourself into what is essentially a subculture so that you don't have to deal with this makes me doubt your commitment. You can personally hold reactionary social views whilst also working on an anti-racist, anti-sexist, anti-homophobia etc platform, if you truly are a pragmatist and fully dedicated to achieving communism.


 No.2861060

I think the EU has made a mistake here tbh. This extension is so short that we don't have the time or breathing space to do any of the things that might resolve the problem. We probably won't even be able to get rid of May.


 No.2861061

>>2861060

What are you talking about it's like 6 months. We can do an election in 6 weeks.


 No.2861062

>>2860942

to fuck an american woman, just offer her some fast food.

>>2861060

>EU making a mistake

my shock. imagine it.


 No.2861063

>>2861061

That won't happen without something changing first. The Tories would have to dispose of May for one thing.


 No.2861064

File: 3689683123b46fe⋯.png (216.51 KB, 1416x786, 236:131, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2861063

You're right but still.

Apparently May is gonna try and pass the WA with labour support next time, will be interesting to see how that goes.

Also pic related, 1% for the CUKs.


 No.2861070

File: 3bf7ae75b6304a6⋯.png (154.28 KB, 1080x1194, 180:199, sketch-1554997116418.png)

>>2861064

Putting these numbers into electoral calculus I got labour having around 305 seats and the Tories with only 268 seats. Yeah with these polling figures I don't see a general election anytime soon, it'd be suicidal for the Tories.


 No.2861073

>>2861070

Honestly we're gonna see a Lab-SNP gov aren't we? I just hope they don't try to block renationalisation.


 No.2861074

>>2861073

I suspect the SNP would try to sabotage Labour without appearing to do so. A competent UK government with majority support in Scotland would be very bad for their main goal of independence.


 No.2861131

File: b4ec24198860d1a⋯.gif (2.23 MB, 320x384, 5:6, 1541607472927.gif)

>>2861070

>>2861064

>when the party for the 1% gets 1%

Ironic


 No.2861164

>>2861074

I dunno, it's a convenient excuse for not holding an indyref "Oh well we tried but we couldn't get one from Labour", also Westminster giving Holyrood more funding would help the SNP keep power so it may work out.


 No.2861176

>>2861164

>convenient excuse for not holding an indyref

Quite the opposite. Its supporters would say 'you could have demanded anything from Corbyn as a condition of putting him in Number 10, and you didn't ask for that!?'. Just like the Lib Dems were crucified for getting so little from the Tories.


 No.2861182

>>2861176

I mean the SNP don't want one rn, and putting the blame on Labour will be enough for the activist base.


 No.2861252

File: 6cb5fa003e0b8e0⋯.png (31.85 KB, 454x767, 454:767, 111.png)

File: a0ad765a92dc012⋯.png (13.57 KB, 339x264, 113:88, 222.png)

>>2861064

All these new polls are pretty wacky.


 No.2861268

>>2861252

>Britain Elects


 No.2861308


 No.2861312

>>2860692

Not racist just don't like them. The fact is the capitalist class are the ones pushing a failed multiculturalism agenda in order to continue to import cheap labour. I live in Burnley and work in Blackburn so if you would like to see what mass immigration has brought to my doorstep then come up and i'll show you around. Its hurt families, it's hurt workers and broken sections of the community. I don't necessarily blame the immigrants but the government and those who actually rule over us from behind the scenes have inflicted this and continue to encourage it. As for Jews they are overrepresented in banking, media and the education system all of which are hostile to myself, my family and my community. Again I don't necessarily hate every individual jew but failing to recognise their collective role in our society is detrimental to us as individuals and to any chance of organising collective political movements. I also loathe Judaism as a religion and its abhorrent practices such as male genital mutilation and kosher. Same applies with Islam and FGM and halal. For the record i'm not particularly a fan of Catholicism, Jehovas Witnesses, Hindus, Sikhs and Buddhists either. As far as homos/trannies/paedos my view on them is that they are mentally ill. I don't hate or particularly fear them but i'd support reopening lunatic asylums to remove the harm the dangerous minority cause themselves and to society. You have also forgotten to accuse me of the other buzzwords capitalists use to control working class people. You should probably accuse me of being a misogynist because I consider abortion murder. And sexist because I recognise gender roles. And a bigot because I voted to leave the EU. Basically I chose to say old fashioned views because its a lot quicker and easier than providing an extensive description of my opinions that most people in the thread wouldn't be interested in reading.


 No.2861323

>>2861312

>buzzwords

>Hey it's raining outside!

>Fuck off with your fucking media buzzwords like "rain"! It's called "water falling from the sky"!

you chose "old fashioned views" because it sounds nicer than "I'm a bigot"


 No.2861356

>>2861323

Rain isn't a buzzword. I'm tolerant to people holding different opinions I just don't like them. Don't care about being called bigot.


 No.2861359

>>2861356

the "buzzwords" you mentioned aren't buzzwords either, just like "rain" isn't.


 No.2861416

File: 8c9c539381e5215⋯.png (538.88 KB, 1080x608, 135:76, ClipboardImage.png)


 No.2861440

>>2861359

T. Ash Sarkar


 No.2861449

>>2861060

>>2861062

I wouldn't exactly call it a mistake, I think that despite everything, the EU still wants the UK to remain, mostly out of self-interest of course,

>>2861416

Kek


 No.2861452

>>2861440

>no I'm not a racist that's just a sjw buzzword haha I just hate pakis


 No.2861453

>>2861449

>the EU still wants the UK to remain

That would have been best served by a longer extension (which is what Tusk was arguing).The 6-month extension was a fudged compromise between that point of view on one hand and the 'just get it over with' school, represented by Macron, on the other.


 No.2861457

>>2861453

>Tfw it took 3 years to finally break the EU.


 No.2861587

>>2860951

the problem isn't really getting in. plenty of brits get into australia, like you say.

my problem is i don't want to be a brit in australia. i want to be an australian, to not be british any more. it's much harder to find out how possible that is because it's probably not the simple legal question it is on paper. (of getting one citizenship and renouncing another.)


 No.2861618

Right lads, bit of fun. Ctrl-f the first half of your postcode and tally up the hits. Winner gets a curly wurly and half a bag of stale wotsits

https://file.wikileaks.org/file/bnp-membership-list.txt

13 for me.


 No.2861632

File: e02ef88f94b09b2⋯.png (51.64 KB, 1670x132, 835:66, export (1).png)


 No.2861640

>>2861618

6, one of them two streets across from where i used to live a few years ago and and 3 of the others in the posh part of town.


 No.2861650

>>2861618

I got 9, did anyone else notice the American?


 No.2861651

>>2861632

Fuck me.

>>2861650

Dozens of USA addresses on there somehow. Dunno if they're all expats or what.


 No.2861716

>>2861618

I only got the two. Some entertaining stuff on there though just scrolling though. Especially like the hobbies.

>Hobbies: criminal justice system, bowls


 No.2861750

>>2861618

>Someone from my village is/was is a member

Watlefug


 No.2861761

>>2861312

>>2861052

This explains why you chose not to reply to my post then lad, because you know you're not capable of doing what is required of a Communist because of your spooks. I assume you don't believe in bodily autonomy either? Do you think that one should be allowed to hold beliefs without any sound reasoning for them, and that any punitive measures against them would be unjust? Your line of reasoning leads to a pomo relativist caricature unfortunately, so I'd be interested in you clarifying things.


 No.2861816

>>2861761

Your reply about communism was to someone else. This >>2860942 isn't me and thats why I felt no need to reply to this >>2861052, so put aside your presumptions. Another reason I didn't get involved with your comment is because i've never proclaimed to be a communist. I'll clarify out of respect to your engagement but first let me point out that I came here hat in hand looking for advice about left wing positions on economics that incorporate right wing social views. Not asking for an in-depth explanation just a pointer of where I should begin which thankfully other anons obliged. I'm not here to spread bigotry or whatever you think either. My desire to research left wing economics is genuine but I don't want to waste time on something that ties me into pretending to be someone i'm not for the sake of ideology. Basically i'm a nationalist who has accepted that there is no meaningful future in capitalism. I'm not disingenuous enough to spread anti-racism and the rest. People would see through it anyway, my family, friends, coworkers and the lads at the pubs know what i'm about the same as I know them. Me telling a delivery driver not be racist when were unloading heavy goods off his lorry isn't going to create the conditions for a revolution. Frankly i'm not even sure what a communist praxis and a pomo relativist means, sounds like some theoretical crap that liberal arts studying uni kids living off debt and their dads credit card would discuss.

If by bodily autonomy you are asking my views on subjects such as abortion i've already stated in this thread that I consider it murder and am strictly against it. I'm also repulsed by tattoos, piercings and hair dye. I'm not saying those things should be illegal, most of my acquaintances would end up in prison then. Well the ones who aren't already locked up… However I am personally repulsed by body modification nonetheless. I'm also strictly against drugs, i've got a history of use that I regret and I take personal responsibility for but I don't tolerate it in my household and would prefer drug use removed from my community. I support free and widely available rehabilitation but do think punitive measures are needed for some. People who are overweight I have some sympathy and pity for as todays food quality is poor and usually a fatty has no time to properly diet and exercise and no money to eat well. Most lads I work with stuff themselves with junk food and coffee just to get through our shift. Even a lot of the lads who aren't fat are malnourished. It's sad to see honest men degraded and bound for an early grave.

Finally I suppose I don't think people should need reasoning sound or otherwise in order to hold beliefs. I think it's valid to believe in god for example. I believe in god because I see a higher power at play when my daughter laughs or in the beauty of the rose bushes at my nans house. And not just on the big questions in life but day to day stuff. I think it's perfectly reasonable to see people of different races as being different merely from observation without needing to put a moments thought into justifying that position or understanding the science behind genetics. A lot of things in life are self evident and the best decisions i've made and the people around me make are on instinct.


 No.2861821

>>2861651

Yeah I havent had a chance to exhaustively look at the list but just flicking through this morning before work I saw a name I recognise. Decent man honestly, he was one of my nans neighbours in her old house and when she was diagnosed with parkinsons he started putting her bins out for her. Where I live was a BNP stronghold at the time of that leak, if I remember rightly they controlled the council so i'm not surprised there is that many. Guess I win the curly wurly and half a bag of stale wotsits.


 No.2861839

>>2861816

I haven't presumed any more than you lad, it was reasonable to think you were the same poster, and if you didn't realise it was intended to be for you then my bad, should have made it clearer. I did assume that you were already committed to left-wing economics, and I know who you are now, I saw the thread you posted, so glad we've cleared that up.

>I'm not here to spread bigotry or whatever you think either.

Point me to where I said this? I never said anything about you spreading bigotry lad, seems like you're making a weird assumption there, I'm saying that your personal social views can negatively influence your ability to make actual strategic + tactical political moves. Reality is that when you're trying to organize a large number of people, they have differing views on things, questions arise with regards to compromise, but also solidarity. It is perfectly possible (although difficult, we all have our spooks after all) to be a racist personally and still show solidarity with another group through a shared struggle. In your case, since you're interested in left-economics, I'm sure you'll understand this as you do more research.

>I'm not disingenuous enough to spread anti-racism and the rest. People would see through it anyway, my family, friends, coworkers and the lads at the pubs know what i'm about the same as I know them. Me telling a delivery driver not be racist when were unloading heavy goods off his lorry isn't going to create the conditions for a revolution.

Again mate, misunderstanding me, you might want to selectively make your ideology known for tactical reasons but it's perfectly possible for people to know what you're about and then still choose to organize with you anyway as long as you both lay down ground rules and have shared goals. There's no need to be disingenuous, there's simply a need to understand various aspects of the social contract + civic life. If you don't do this, then your only logical line of holding certain beliefs personally bleeds over into public life and ends up leading to subjectivist relative nonsense and then conflict over mandates that arise from that. There needs to be clear distinctions on these things so that we know where we stand, when it comes to the actual practical things we're doing in the real world. I would prefer to know that you were a racist so it's all out in the open, because you'd be honest and we could move beyond that and figure out where we can cooperate. I couldn't give a shit about liberal outrage tbh, ultimately you can't police people's thoughts or beliefs but you can at least make sure they commit to a set of ethics, at least in civil society.

>sounds like some theoretical crap that liberal arts studying uni kids living off debt and their dads credit card would discuss.

Mate, you've come here to learn about economics, you're better than spouting almost verbatum quotes from people who think being working class is an identity, rather than an economic relationship at the root. I've only got some GCSEs because I'm guessing like you and a lot of people you know, you weren't afforded the opportunity to do any better, but I've put the time and effort in to learn stuff. Praxis is just the technical term for actual practical real world activity, and the pomo thing was just a bit of a meme, most of us round here hate poncy detached middle class kids, we just bother to learn the reasons why.

The rest of the stuff I was asking were genuine questions, I'll reply in detail when I get a bit more time later, I just wanted to understand more of your perspective and beliefs.


 No.2861845

Are Tories going the way of the dodo in your opinion? There's always going to be conservative/reactionary politics but could the tories start splitting like trots or something?


 No.2861848

>>2861845

The talk of a Tory split is just MSM gossip. Every time a party is in trouble you hear that they're going to split, they may never win an election again, they're going to be replaced by a third party. This is especially ridiculous in the case of the Tories who are famously resilient as a party. The wing of the party that is currently out of power will prefer to bide its time until it returns to power, like the Labour left did for over 30 years.


 No.2862035

>>2861848

I don't know man, there hasn't been a divisive an issue as Brexit unironically since the Corn Laws, I mean Hammond and Rees Mogg have virtually nothing in common beyond the Conservative next to their name.

It depends on what happens though, the remain wing of the party are big enough cucks that unless CUK somehow takes off they'll find some way to remain in the party, no matter what principles they have to sacrifice. The Brexiteers are a different matter. I could see a lot of them genuinely jumping ship for say the Brexit Party if May keeps on fucking them and they fail to get a real Brexiteer as PM next time.


 No.2862163

In Blair’s Castle Grey Skull, it is always 1997. Blair is like some inverted Miss Havisham, frozen not at the moment of his defeat and failure, but just before his moment of greatest success. Be cautious, don’t do anything to jeopardise the project. Blairism was this particular form of false promise, this deferral — if we are careful now, tomorrow we can do more… But tomorrow never arrives, the aim is always to be in government, the price is always the lack of any real power to change the inherited parameters of the possible. This is the formula: government without power, an increasingly unpopular populism.The illusion of Blairism is that it was an overcoming of the defeats of the 1980s rather than their final consequence. It was a post-traumatic normalisation of catastrophe, not any sort of new dawn. Its legacy is organisational as much as ideological: a Labour Party that napalmed its grassroots (contempt for, and fear of the working class being a signature element of Blair’s rendition of populism) and which now beams down policy and PR from some rarefied Thick Of It Oxford PPE helicarrier circling miles above earth. The project remains getting into government, but without Blair’s showman-messiah charisma to cover over the vacuum beneath this aspiration. Miliband’s awkwardness stems as much from this lack of any vision as from any personal quirks. There is nothing animating the transparently choreographed moves: tack to the right on immigration, a little to the left on taxation, etc. The ambition — to be the slightly lesser evil — is painfully clear to all, and can inspire no one.


 No.2862362

>>2862035

>Hammond and Rees Mogg have virtually nothing in common

Apart from neoliberalism and austerity, i.e. the main planks of the Tory platform.

>they fail to get a real Brexiteer as PM next time.

They almost certainly will manage that though. They were very unlucky in 2016 because Gove and Johnson fucked each other up and then Leadsom allowed herself to be bought off with a Cabinet job (which is probably what she wanted from the start). It will go to the membership next time and they will elect the Brexiter candidate.


 No.2862377

File: 89b9acee13d428e⋯.png (259.29 KB, 600x673, 600:673, gott_strafe_england_1.png)

File: 5c939af8fc53d20⋯.jpg (7.14 KB, 136x176, 17:22, Gott_strafe_England_-_Proj….jpg)

File: a389a9e7e58e9ec⋯.jpg (22.08 KB, 237x264, 79:88, gottstrafe.jpg)

>>2860212

No, your suffering has just begone. More blood for the blood god. Gott strafe england.


 No.2862425

File: ed55993e2bc3f35⋯.png (414.16 KB, 1190x599, 1190:599, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2861848

Projected Seats:

LAB: 24 (+4)

BXP: 12 (+12)

CON: 12 (-7)

UKIP: 12 (-12)

GRN: 4 (+1)

LDM: 3 (+2)

NAT: 3 (=)

Ngl love to see the melts implode when Labour dick the EU elections.


 No.2862434

AS for the death of the tory party, well aside from the fact the party is literally dying I think it's main threat is that it no longer is an "institutional party", aka one which is seen as a part of fundamental british government rather than just of british politics. This sounds weird, but remember we used to have a two-party system where it was Liberals and Tories (well also Irish nationalists but let's forget about them for a bit) at the top. Then WWI happened, the filthy working classes were given the vote and womyns were too, and then we have the 1920s: where there were three parties of government that , around eachother. Then the depression hits, a national government forms, the liberals split into three parties and they never recover until David Steel signs a pact with this weird new group called the SDP: and still they have never had a PM since DLG. This is what could happen to the tories rn ngl. Who replaces them is a tricky one though, it was obviously gonna be Labour in the 1920s, but now? Will it be right wing populists or mega liberals? Nobody knows.


 No.2862459

>>2862425

So the Tories are going to be campaigning as part of the ECR (a non-separatist group) while their party policy is to leave the EU. Weird. Also pretty amusing that ChUKa are projected to win 0 (zero) seats.

>>2862434

> it was obviously gonna be Labour in the 1920s, but now?

And that is why the Liberal Party died but the Tories won't. Populism in this country is feeble and we saw in the 2017 election how easily its supporters were lured away by Labour's socdem revival on one hand and the Tories' 'crush the saboteurs' fascist posturing on the other. As for the mega-liberals, the appetite for that is tiny and the Lib Dems have been appealing to it without success for ages. The Tories will continue to be the party of low taxes, 'aspiration', law & order, and stability (without actually delivering on any of that in practice).


 No.2862473

>>2862425

Why do Brexit and UKIP have so much voting percentage when UKIP and Brexit have so little in GE polling?


 No.2862474

>>2862473

Electoral systems fam


 No.2862478

>>2862473

Also many people would never vote UKIP/Brexit parties in a general election as they would rather have Torys/Labour in Government. But a lot of people are going to use the European elections (if we have them) to show dissatisfaction with how Brexit is going.


 No.2862482

Who are you going to vote for in the EU elections (if you are going to vote at all)? Is No2EU standing again?

>>2862377

>Gott strafe England

>Actually punching Scotland

Based


 No.2862506

>>2862482

>Who are you going to vote for in the EU elections (if you are going to vote at all)? Is No2EU standing again?

Labour tbh, purely (outside a tribalist) because my MEP voted against Article 13. Also No2EU basically dissolved since almost all of the unions are pro-Corbyn.


 No.2862508

>>2862482

<Gott strafe England

<Actually punching Scotland

>Based

Also let's the fucking Welsh get-off Scot-Free.


 No.2862514

File: bd61f65b20a5635⋯.png (20.46 KB, 255x125, 51:25, bf39f69d64922ee3b1a7a1c2c0….png)


 No.2862519

>>2862514

You little shit


 No.2862524

File: ef0ee7d0c6ff2a1⋯.png (262.35 KB, 1229x743, 1229:743, banter heuristic .png)

Lol at the EU election poll putting Labour into downing street and the tories sub-200.


 No.2862633

File: b2734613ad8b5bc⋯.jpg (93.71 KB, 529x758, 529:758, paxbritannica.jpg)

File: 25ba00992aa732b⋯.jpg (198.06 KB, 901x1302, 901:1302, british-india.jpg)

File: 2d964f00a1d14a7⋯.jpg (489.15 KB, 1800x2577, 600:859, british-near-east.jpg)

File: 7f8fa2fa9890db3⋯.jpg (448.54 KB, 719x1024, 719:1024, british-middle-east.jpg)

New UK law: Up to 15 years jail for watching terrorist content

>It will be an offence to view terrorist material online just once – and could incur a prison sentence of up to 15 years – under new UK laws.

>The Counter-Terrorism and Border Security Bill was granted Royal Assent yesterday, updating a previous Act and bringing new powers to law enforcement to tackle terrorism.

>But a controversial inclusion was to update the offence of obtaining information "likely to be useful to a person committing or preparing an act of terrorism" so that it now covers viewing or streaming content online.

>The rules as passed into law are also a tightening of proposals that had already been criticised by human rights groups and the independent reviewer of terrorism legislation, Max Hill.

>Originally, the proposal had been to make it an offence for someone to view material three or more times – but the three strikes idea has been dropped from the final Act.

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2019/02/13/uk_counter_terror_act_royal_assent/

>Viewing terrorist propaganda online in the UK could now land you in jail - under a new law that's just come into force. Government says the new measure is aimed at preventing terror attacks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptNN5MEhioI

First they lock up the guy exposing the criminals who run our governments (and threaten to extradite him to a US supermax gulag for life), and now they've passed a law where you will get 15 years in jail for viewing anything online (whether accidental or intentional) the UK government arbitrarily deems to be "terrorist material."


 No.2862636

>>2862524

what's "BRX"?


 No.2862638

File: 55cee9b1d1e0eb7⋯.jpg (70.67 KB, 345x512, 345:512, 55cee9b1d1e0eb7b95e7b9be08….jpg)

>>2862524

Hey non brit here, so what’s the story with the coastal areas that like labour?

Also are the southern whales more unionist than the northerners?


 No.2862652

File: ad79adc21007da2⋯.png (544.31 KB, 1248x1039, 1248:1039, 8QeXxYx.png)

>>2862633

The Act also provides for jailing people for up to 10 years if they spend over a month in a 'designated area' abroad. It's times like this that you realise how close to tyranny we are at all times. Parliament can pass whatever horrific legislation.it wants without any oversight, thanks to our lack of a written constitution.

>>2862638

That map is not realistic. Pic related is the map of the last election. Also don't really know why coastal areas would be any less likely to vote Labour.

>Also are the southern whales more unionist than the northerners?

Yeah, western/northern Wales is more remote and less integrated culturally into the UK.


 No.2862657

File: 3c57ad53c050676⋯.png (39.88 KB, 1213x714, 1213:714, Untitled.png)

>>2862633

How the fuck did this get through so easily. How did Corbyn fail to oppose it?


 No.2862668


 No.2862774

File: 3d6d0285e046b43⋯.png (10.97 KB, 266x208, 133:104, Untitled.png)

From these new polls it looks like the Tories are finally paying the price for the absolute state of this government.


 No.2862830

>>2862657

Maybe trying to avoid the whole "terrorist sympathiser" thing. I reckon for the average person "Corbyn opposes ban on terrorist propaganda" is enough to make them ree without reading the article.


 No.2862835

>>2862830

Corbyn has a great record of fearlessly doing and saying things the media can use against him. I can't believe that he would allow such a gross infringement of civil rights just because he's afraid of what the Sun might say. This is the guy who stood up for Shamima Begum. And Diane Abbott, who I can see voted for the bill, is even more touchy about civil rights. She complained about the police knocking moped thieves from their bikes, for God's sake..


 No.2862841

>>2862835

You're quite right tbh and i'm not defending him for this, just trying to understand why there was no resistance to it.


 No.2863090

>>2861839

Yeah perhaps I was a bit presumptive and did misunderstand. I didn't mean to be rude. I think I understand your point about social contract and civic life. I suppose i've never considered organisation probably because i've never really been in a position to organise a large number of people. In the interest of clarity then yeah i'd have to say i'm racist. I have no problem with a Paki in Pakistan but I do discriminate against the Pakis on the Old Whalley road in Blackburn. I do consider them unwelcome intruders and despair when I visit family graves in Nelson where one side of the cemetery is segregated for Islamic burial. And it's not just muslims, jews and foreign races that I couldn't share the struggle and show solidarity toward. I'm never going to be willing to march for gays or feminist causes. As I said I think I understand your point about the need to basically see eye to eye when organising but I doubt I can overcome what you call spooks and therefore maybe a foray into the left is futile and unfeasible despite that i recognise the total failure of neoliberal/capitalist economics.


 No.2863091

>>2862636

Presumably the Brexit party but i'm skeptical that the poll is accurate.


 No.2863097

Honestly, how well would a Labour-SNP coalition work?

I’m worried the SNP might try to push a second independence referendum if Brexit goes through. Though maybe they could be appealed to with even greater devolution?

I really don’t want an independent Scotland.


 No.2863099

>>2863097

There won't be a coalition, it will be confidence and supply. If the SNP demand an indyref will be difficult, because the leadership don't want one for a bit too. It's honestly impossible to see how it would work out.


 No.2863150

>>2863099

Yeah, I’m honestly worried about a second Scottish ref in the next 20 years. They’re key to our identity and I don’t want to see them go.

Perhaps a labour government that ends austerity policies in Scotland and invests into Scottish manufacturing and industry will be enough to keep them in.


 No.2863152

>>2863150

I dont think we need to worry about the SNP, they have kind of been fucked by Labour. When Labour went more left-wing and took their place as the "left wing option" in Scotland they had to make the choice about the future direction of the party, either move to the left or move to the right. Moving left would probably keep them in power in Scotland and keep most of their MPs (loosing a few to the Torys probably). However it isolate a lot of voters and screw their chances in any future indy-ref which for them is more important than MPs. So they have had to move to the right to keep indy-ref 2 alive. The only thing really keeping them in power right now is Brexit and Scottish Labour being shit.


 No.2863160

>>2863150

I think Labour needs to go on a union offensive in Scotland. Basically the party up there has no real identity or aim atm, Murphey, Dugdale, and Leonard have all appeared to be damp squibs. Atm the best Scottish Labour lad is Paul Sweeney and he's down in Westminster. What is needed is a real offensive into the trade unionist constituency in Scotland and reintegrating Labour into the industrial working class: which Scotland still maintains to a far larger degree than the rest of the UK. There has already been some inroads made, with the party picking up 3/7 of the seats in Glasgow, but more could be done. There is a lot of potential in bringing in the trade union element of Scottish society, which sits at 30%, into a single party. That's what Labour needs to do north of the border, and ignore constitutional issues for now. Following that, with a party of the trade union class (which will mostly be the industrial working class and the middle middle class) can then make the case for a union, but starting at it with such a constitutional strength is not gonna work. Honestly if I was running Labour's indyref 2 campaign, I would just go with the slogan "There's power in a Union" and work through that. "The SNP and tories want to rule and divide us, only united under and as labour can we be strong" et al. That can undercut the SNP's support while building a solid bloc.


 No.2863165

File: af36bd5401e9185⋯.png (127.87 KB, 1268x463, 1268:463, af36bd5401e91850550f2d46d1….png)

>>2863090

No worries lad, I think we both jumped the gun a bit. Therein lies the contradiction though, you can be as left as you want with economics but ultimately you're gonna have to make compromises to achieve that that includes working with people you have mutual animosity towards, and if you're not willing to take a step back and accept the social contract then unforunately it leads to conflict with these groups. And if you're gonna end up having to do that and you know it, then it goes back to what you were saying about having to be disingenuous, just on the opposite side. You'd have to pretend to organize with people you hate because that's Politics, and then after the fact you'd betray them. Spooks is a bit of a meme term round here from an Egoist called Max Stirner, it basically means when you elevate an Idea to such a position that it takes precedence over your own actual interests in life. You can see how some beliefs that one might hold could actually cause you problems if you put them before yourself. For example, me personally, I'm not a fan of Abortion at all, I think it's pretty sad and traumatic for families to have to go through that, but I realise that under Capitalism many people don't have a choice because the alternative would be worse for them & the kid. I see Communism as providing the conditions for Abortion to basically not exist,

because not only would people have more education on the matter, and more alternatives, but they'd also be more economically secure and be able to raise a family on their own terms. Because of this, I see it as a necessary "evil" under capitalism, but even under this system it could be drastically reduced. Taking the logic of this problem to it's end though, you see how as long as the working class is being fucked by the ruling class, there is no end to this thing that people might consider a social ill. Of course, there are also philosophical & ethical dimensions to the abortion issue, but even putting those aside you can see how the structures of the system either cause or make these problems worse.

There are multiple other more complicated ideas about why Nationalism as it's understood by Traditionalists runs into problems with Left Economics but understanding those will depend on how far you're going to go with reading about Economics.

The thing I always try to tell Nationalists is that at the end of the day, ironically, Communism is the only thing that could even feasibly lead to you having your own little enclave relatively insulated from exposure to social beliefs you don't agree with, because Capitalism inherently creates most of the problems you have through Imperialism & Development causing Immigration, to your Culture & Traditions being destroyed because of Capitalism needing to turn everything into a Market, bulldozing away people's way of life and replacing it with this bland commodified dogshit. Ultimately all that culture is is how a community of people go about existing in a place in the world, and Capitalism can't allow that, it has to change what we do and how we think, destroying freedom in the pursuit of profit. Pic related from here is always something I think demonstrates it well.


 No.2863166

>>2863152

I agree with this analysis, also doesn't help the SNP's hard remain stance is alienating either pro-Leave habitual SNP voters (which is why places like Moray or Aberdeenshire are turning tory) or Pro-Leave Indy voters (which are politically homeless rn, and as such are less likely to tribally vote SNP and perhaps vote for people like the tories or Labour out of policy concerns over constitutional stances). But I agree, none of this is helped by the fact that Scottish labour is shite atm.


 No.2863171

Tbh since Cunt Danukla is gonna be a UKIP MEP candidate in Scotland, how long before Carl of Swindon runs in that seat?


 No.2863174

>>2863171

Carl is running in the south west MEP region I think


 No.2863176

>>2863166

Tbh I hate how people act like Scotland (and London) voted 100% for Remain. The 38% vote for Leave was not massively less than the 45% vote for independence.

>>2863150

>They’re key to our identity

Spooky. Scottish independence is good for the world because it strikes a blow against British imperialism. The armed forces would lose Faslane and would have issues retaining/recruiting its disproportionate number of Scottish personnel. The economic impact is hard to predict but the UK would lose a lot of its oil reserves.

Don't think it will happen for decades though.


 No.2863179

>>2863174

Fuck me if he gets into the EU parliament. Here's hoping most of UKIp's votes go to Farage's Brexit Party (which I'm gonna call that from now on so we adopt the Aussie thing of having "X's Y Party").


 No.2863183

>>2863176

>Tbh I hate how people act like Scotland (and London) voted 100% for Remain. The 38% vote for Leave was not massively less than the 45% vote for independence.

My grandpa is a Moray native and he worked out that the split between Remain and Leave was 163 votes up there. Funnily enough Moray, one of the SNP's oldest seats, was won by the tories in 2017. Coincidence? I think not. Should also add that Moray was pretty much nationally aligned in the indyref vote. Also one thing people forget is that indyref1 had a really fucking high turnout at 84%: The SNP are gonna have a hard time getting pro-indy voters to the polls while status quo voters are more likely to vote since the status quo is easier to defend (which is why Remain's defeat was all the more impressive).

As for "Scotland being independent would strike at British imperialism", Scotland would 100% just become an imperial money laundering operation like Ireland, or a NATO vassal state like the baltics: let's not bare any pretenses to that.


 No.2863188

File: 406f74cb414b9e6⋯.jpg (69.25 KB, 496x744, 2:3, friedman-13280-portrait-me….jpg)

>There's nothing "socialist" about UBI even,

this +100000

it would be porky's main assault on the european social democrat "welfare state" model, which all porkies hate with all of their heart since it was introduced in the late 1800s in germany.

the UBI concept was invented by some of the worst scumbags who ever lived, including milton friedman, that is neoliberal/fascist bankers, insurance providers and oligarch "investors". so aside from braindead liberals the worst of the worst capitalists push for it, although they don't do it openly, but fund stupid liberal UBI promoters in media and politics from behind via "philantropic" foundations and whatnot.

UBI is designed to substitute ALL social security measures, including pensions for the elderly, at once with nothing. meanwhile oligarchs will get rid of progressive, relative taxes and are to pay the same amount of taxes as low pay workers or none at all. what's more, the "markets" will simply increase prices/inflation over time, which will eradicate all short-term positive effects on the income of "middle-class" workers at the time during the time UBI's introduction. middle-class, low wage workers and the unemployed will have long-term siginficantly LESS income than before the introduction of UBI. in case of unemployment workers will be left with no benefits at all, because the UBI's main point is precisely to take away all social security responsibilities from the state to push workers into either buying private unemployment//pension insurances (if they can afford it) or force workers to enroll into shit pay jobs with the worst working conditions on offer just to stay alive.


 No.2863191

>>2863188

Who mentioned UBI?


 No.2863192

>>2863191

wrong thread and i can't delete the post. i'm sorry.


 No.2863202

>>2863192

It's fine. On UBI, this was proposed a month or so ago but there was a plan to replace tax credits with the a £1 income tax rate and give rebates for it for all those earning under £125k. This would work far better IMO.


 No.2863206

>>2863176

>Spooky. Scottish independence is good for the world because it strikes a blow against British imperialism.

Or, you know, we could elect a government that ends imperialist foreign policy without dividing the country

And you’re implying an independent Scotland wouldn’t instantly become a US/EU vassal.


 No.2863208

>>2863152

>>2863160

Honestly, reading this it seems to me Labour should dedicate more resources to winning Scottish Industrial areas. Seats in Scotland would propel us to a far stronger majority next election, and give Trade Unions a far stronger mandate to party policy, further cementing Labour as a Socialist party.

The main backing of the SNP is overwhelmingly the young. Winning them over cripples the SNP’s vote.


 No.2863216

>>2863206

Yeah I agree sottish independence would just turn Scotland into a tax haven with the SNP trying to win over bankers from London.


 No.2863302

>>2863208

>The main backing of the SNP is overwhelmingly the young. Winning them over cripples the SNP’s vote.

Not quite, while the SNP are the party of A) the young "Econ Socdem SocLib" demographic (I remember being up in my mum's village during the summer and speaking to someone my age, she's an SNP member and 100% would be a Labour member if she lived in England), also a decent chunk of its demographic is B) industrial "left-behind" workers from Glasgow in particular C) catholics (both irish-descended and trad) D) rural residents from north of the belt (As my grandpa put it "The SNP used to be the only people who gave two shits about this area"), E) actually mobile young high income professionals; especially from places like Dundee, and F) left-behind people in fishing towns. It's quite a wide coalition but since the SNP is nominally a causal party (as opposed to sectional or broad-tent one), but it is starting to crack: Ds & Fs are moving towards the tories & Lib Dems, As are moving towards the Scottish Greens, and Bs are shifting back to Labour under Corbyn (the Glasgow wins were the best sign of this). But still, the only way I can see the SNP losing their first place is if the whole Alex Salmond thing exposes like institutional cover-ups of his alleged perversion: I think that would be too much to bare for a lot of the activist base and they would disperse into other pro-indy units (Scots Greens, SSP, perhaps a right-wing nat party).

But yeah, Labour specifically targeting the industrial working class: not just in the Western Belt but also in places like Aberdeen and Moray (who have a lot of agri-industry, oil works, and ofc, whisky). Do that and you have a membership base, from that you build a genuine working class politics. But it won't happen while SLab remains in its current rut.

>>2863216

There is no doubt the SNP wouldn't try to go full neolib-corporatist celtic tiger upon independence: especially if you read the Green Paper from 2014 which is basically "We use oil money to lower taxes and everything will be fine". Honestly promoting Oil in Scotland from a macro standpoint is a fucking awful idea considering much heavy, and especially light, industry remains: you're just gonna give yourself Dutch Disease.


 No.2863340

the thing you have to realise about scotland is that there's no real scottish bourgeoisie. the scottish bourgeoisie integrate themselves into british civil society, not scottish civil society. the illusion that scotland is more left wing comes almost entirely from this situation, because once you remove the businessmen from the highest rungs, people with a much greater interest in government support (head teachers, churchmen, academia, etc.) take the lead.

the scottish parliament is basically their dream realised. all the power in the world to commission policy papers and to talk a good talk (well, so long as you don't actually listen.) and bugger all real economic power to redistribute things, alter the balance of social power, stimulate industry, or basically do anything except make that class feel good. (beyond the token measures already adopted. in other words, the scottish parliament is already doing 105% of what it can do.) this kind of class analysis is sorely missing from any consideration of the scottish condition, which would much rather travel down drier, somehow even more tiring lines. (brian souter! blairites! imperialism! second vote RISE!) mostly as people try to push a cause, rather than to disinterested analyse. (something that will probably result in covering the entirety of scotland in the thick black tar of contempt.)

p.s. scottish labour has absolutely no plans on how to salvage itself. your plan could be for jeremy corbyn to walk across the river clyde while reading scripture and it would at least be a plan, putting you above scottish labour at current. their complete lack of strategic planning horrifies me. someone, anyone, please try and sort that out.

tl;dr scotland is a tiring place. it will exhaust you.

>>2863302

>you're just gonna give yourself Dutch Disease.

i mean, both scotland and the UK already got a pretty nasty case of that in the 80s. it's pretty easy to avoid the worst of so long as you keep all the money offshore in an oil fund so it doesn't give you major balance of payments surpluses. (like norway)


 No.2863376

>>2863340

This is good analysis, with one caveat that I want to add which is that there is a bourgeoisie that is pro-independence but they tend to be foreign: for example Americans in Dundee or a certain US president. The SNP tries and does pander to this group to a significant degree.


 No.2863773

>>2863340

>i mean, both scotland and the UK already got a pretty nasty case of that in the 80s. it's pretty easy to avoid the worst of so long as you keep all the money offshore in an oil fund so it doesn't give you major balance of payments surpluses

Nah the risk is less about political economy and more about the macro economy: as investment shifts to the safe bet of resources over other industries. I mean the whole thing basically deindustrialised the Netherlands because of Groningen.


 No.2863788

File: bb8d73c304e166c⋯.jpg (105.46 KB, 889x486, 889:486, bb8d73c304e166c7cba0be7fdb….jpg)

Burger here why the fuck are the British and particularly British Jews so fucking retarded about "muh antisemitism" and how the fuck did Labour shifting left actually make it even easier to spin them as more antisemitic than the Right?

I mean they try to do this in the USA but most young Jews at least know how stupid it is and for the most part it hasn't worked. Is it literally that you faggot are too stupid to not conflate antizionism with antisemtimism?


 No.2863791

>>2863788

it's a ploy to discredit Corbyn and co, but anyone with a brain not full of neoliberal ideology can see it for how fake it is


 No.2863820

>>2863788

It dates back to the leadership of Ed Miliband (himself the son of a camp holocaust survivor), who criticised the Gaza war and the jewish press (by that I mean the press in the jewish community, not some lugenpresse bullshit) criticised him massively. Now Corbyn has links to figures in Hamas and Hezbollah; which doesn't help, but a lot of it is smearing shit. Not to say there aren't anti-semites, but it is made out to be a far bigger problem that it is.

But the thing you have to realise is that organised british jewry is immensely pro-zionist: partially because of Britain's history with zionism, partially because a lot of working class jews left for America or Israel after the war leaving behind the middle class zionist population, partially because the rest of british jewry aren't organised (we never had Bundists for example, and left-wing working class Jewish activism was born in the 1930s but died by the 1950s because of aforementioned reasons). As such, the zionist elements of british jewry get the right to speak for the whole of it, which is a big problem (which I think is now starting to be addressed). SO yeah, we don't have an organised bundist/left-wing jewish movement to push-back when the jewish press brand someone as anti-semitic for not liking Israel or criticising links with AIPAC: and it's a bit shite.

Also one thing to mention is a significant part of jewish jewry weren't raised jewish, because they are Kindertransport. These kids were mostly sent to the countryside where people didn't even know what a jew was and they were brought-up Christian Englishmen who found-out in their late childhood their heritage. Now while this isn't talked about a lot, a lot of the jewish community doesn't consider these people to be "Proper jews" and so when they speak about stuff they get branded as "the wrong sort of jew".


 No.2863849

File: 8d8275ee2a96dea⋯.png (425.35 KB, 627x893, 33:47, carl of rapetown.PNG)


 No.2863857

>>2863820

I should add that the left-wing of british jewry was explicitly zionist: the modern Jewish Labour Movement was founded as Poale Zion and from its inception was a zionist organisation. As I said, the only element of the british jewry that was involved in politics (since obs the Heredi aren't involved even though they aren;t insignificant in the british jewish population) has been zionist.

Another point should be that support or criticism has now actually basically become a political stance in british politics, especially since the CUKs will make it one at the next election. The most interesting part is that the liberal democrats are far more likely to fall on the anti-zionist side, partially because their foreign policy is driven by liberal pacifism, partially because one of their most prominent parliamentary figures is a Palestinian BDS activist (and she may soon be leader).


 No.2863886

>>2863788

I would unironically watch some norman finklestein interviews, particularly the one where he btfos novara about the whole anti-semetism thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxEN0q6YHf0

Idr exactly when the skype interview with him starts but it's partway through and he btfos the intersectionalist pussy-footing around the issue.


 No.2863903

File: a6438921f063bdb⋯.png (917.56 KB, 851x638, 851:638, ClipboardImage.png)

They're fucking desperate.


 No.2863986

>>2863773

I mean, that's still avoidable but the long post leaves out that Norway's oil supply was nationalised so only state investment could really move. It's harder for the SNP just clipping 10% for an oil fund.


 No.2864130

File: ee00b2179d8dce5⋯.png (466.64 KB, 1199x619, 1199:619, ClipboardImage.png)

The salt is real.


 No.2864149

>>2862524

Buckingham will be inaccurate, labour and the liberals dont contest bercows seat so its not actually on the verge of flipping to ukip.


 No.2864163

>>2864149

I mean that is basically a meme map anyways because no-one will vote in a general like they would in an EU election, but still.


 No.2864291

File: 74459f7411363eb⋯.png (85.78 KB, 800x262, 400:131, ClipboardImage.png)


 No.2864535

File: cc7c7981302e1cf⋯.png (395.51 KB, 1199x547, 1199:547, ClipboardImage.png)

lol


 No.2864808

>>2864291

>That discord screencap

Kek


 No.2865072

>>2864535

CUK being beaten by everyone but the fucking sheep is just embarrassing.


 No.2865079

>>2864808

Honestly these people are gonna be doomed by themselves at this point.

>>2865072

Honestly I was dreading the EU elections but to have them and see the CUKs get rekt is more than enough for me.


 No.2865246

>>2864535

>25% Leave

>46% Centrist/split

>27% Remain

Where is the other 2%?


 No.2865259

>>2865246

Prods and Republicans.


 No.2865275

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RUUUpGok68s

>Fully Automated Luxury Communism

>libertarian communism

These people will be purged after the revolution right?


 No.2865335

>>2865072

I wonder if they'll start getting less sniffy about a merger with the Lib Dems if they get trounced badly enough. Their current strategy is utterly retarded.


 No.2865339

>>2865335

Them cucking-out the lib dems would be so hilarious. The best part is that there are rumours that Nick Boles (remainer tory) might join the Lib Dems instead of them: which would be a fucking laugh.


 No.2865415

>>2864291

Wrong link?


 No.2865456

>>2865275

What's the problem faggot?


 No.2865463


 No.2865479

>>2865456

They make the left out to be comical utopians maybe?


 No.2865497

>>2865335

>>2865339

They probably made some delusional assumption that they'd replay the SDP, rocket to popularity, and dictate a merger with the Lib Dems that would give them all major positions in the new party (presumably Chuka would be leader I bet)

At this point it's just stubbornly not wanting to admit they got cucked by Labour veering more Remain which kept the other members in line


 No.2865507

>>2865497

I agree, also they have really buggered-up their launch: you can't even become a member yet and they've launched three times now.


 No.2865543

>>2865479

Did you watch the video?

>If automation takes up all the jobs than we would have to fall into fully automated luxury communism

And at this rate of your revolution, this will be the communism we'll get.


 No.2865556

>>2865497

>At this point it's just stubbornly not wanting to admit they got cucked by Labour veering more Remain which kept the other members in line

Not even that, the CUKs haven't even been able to get Margaret Hodge on-side: it's a sign they have failed out of sheer incompetence. You know the launch was originally meant to be 12 people? But in the days leading up to it they fudged so many things that a load backed-out.

And now there is a real chance that the whole project will become "Pro-Euro Conservatives 2.0" as more and more europhile tories join the enterprise (like their two MEPs).


 No.2865662

File: ad9671a72f10c2e⋯.jpg (225.35 KB, 1024x680, 128:85, gettyimages-830180128-1024….jpg)

>>2865556

>Pro-Euro Conservatives

tfw you focus group the single least popular political position in britain circa 1999


 No.2865813

>>2865662

It's a bit of path dependency tbh: as pro-EU tories leave the party and join the CUKs, the CUKs will come to resemble the beliefs of Pro-EU tories. Since it appears that signs of Labour members leaving has stopped, this will happen more and more.

Also is it me or does the bloke on the left look like a cross between Nick Clegg and 1990s Colin Firth?


 No.2865831

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-47960775

Tories gonna try to implement this porn age verification thing on the 15th of July this year. VPN companies must be rubbing their hands right about now.

I'm still not sure that the Government actually understands the internet yet.


 No.2865853

>>2865275

>>2865456

These (mainly) middle class Londoner "socialist" might not be great but they are useful. They make socialism and socialist ideas easy for young people to digest and have a pretty big audience. Not only that but they will be important if labour ever wants to shape up the media class within the BBC/ITV/Sky ect they can fill that gap pretty well. What is important that these people never get anywhere actual power or influence.


 No.2865856

>>2865831

>I'm still not sure that the Government actually understands the internet yet

Of course they do, they're just pandering to Daily Mail readers who don't.


 No.2865860

>>2864535

Why is polling in the UK so awful? It seems like the Brexit Party is at 27% voting intentions now.

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1118480874893381632


 No.2865879

>>2865860

That poll assumes half of UKIPs voters go to the Brexit party and I'm not sure that will actually happen

I'll believe it if the other two polling companies show a Brexit Party surge


 No.2865885

>>2865831

The parent company for Pornhub/redtube/etc owns majority stake in the company behind the verification system; this is just them colluding with Tories to centralize that market. They will license out this verification system not only to irl vendors but basically all other porn producers, effectively giving them a platform monopoly. This also likely has a few auxillary benefits for the state given what we're dealing with here, even if it's just something as miniscule as making more people pay for passports lmao. Pretty sure the more likely outcome is access to data which will then be sold to third parties and kept in databases for monitoring purposes.


 No.2865887

>>2865885

But Katie from Pornhub on reddit says that it hurts Pornhub! You wouldn't say she's lying wouldn't you?


 No.2865890

>>2865860

That's only for the EU elections mind.


 No.2865895

>>2865860

>YouGov

X to doubt


 No.2865898

File: 087e71b6f28bf12⋯.png (1.57 MB, 768x1024, 3:4, ClipboardImage.png)

Fucking Mansfield Chad…


 No.2865932

>>2865895

this too, it honestly amazes me that here in the US they're rightfully considered a literal who poller while UK news orgs take them as gospel.


 No.2865940

>>2865932

Tbf, most people think yougov is a shit poller in the Uk but yeah.


 No.2865969

>>2865860

There for EU elections not for general elections. At the moment in a general election Labour is doing pretty well getting 34 to 40% compared to Torys 28 to 35%. However polls kind of mean fuck all outside of election cycles. Then again there are local elections coming up in most of England so it will be interesting to see who gets effected the most by Brexit party.

http://britainelects.com/polling/westminster/


 No.2865971

>>2865932

It was taken seriously enough by r/ukpolitics


 No.2865988

>>2865456

The Italian pushing libertarian communism is a fool and it's hardly a surprise that fascists are ascendant once again when he is their opposition. The problem is that there will never be a revolution with people like him at the helm. Should it happen despite him then there is no reason for him to have a role afterwards. People like that will only be detrimental and deserve to be purged.

>>2865853

The worrying thing is that the likes of Ash Sakar and Owen Jones are already near actual power and already have influence. Both are all over the BBC, Sky news, etc and they socialise with MPs. The yoofs who follow them are themselves just middle class urban 'socialists', the type who will never truly understand what it means to struggle and inevitably abandon the cause in exchange for taking their place in the neoliberal status quo. That harmful propaganda about luxury automated communism is damaging, delusional and utterly absurd and isn't winning over anyone. It's a laughing stock and certainly not creating a generation of dedicated revolutionaries. If I were more conspiratorial i'd suggest that both aforementioned media personalities are neoliberal plants attempting to discredit socialism. Unfortunately I expect thats not the case and that they believe themselves to be genuine. I reckon when Ash has her nails done each week she tells the poor lass paid a pittance to do it how she will soon be out of a job, but thats ok because automation will make everyones lives as vapid and meaningless as her own.

Fuck it when the revolution comes i'm doing a Pol Pot on them wether you lads agree or not. Either them and their ilk will work on the land or they will fertilise the soil.


 No.2865991

>>2865969

I don't think the Brexit party are running in local election. They definitely don't have candidates where I live.


 No.2865997

>>2865991

>>2865991

Nah they arent, they were founded last week.


 No.2866001

>>2865988

They socialise with MPs but don't hold any power internally within the Labour party. I see them more as useful idiots, at the end of the day they are pumping out anti-austerity/labour party propaganda which is being picked up by left-wing but politically inactive young people.


 No.2866080

https://www.ukip.org/national-ukip-news-item.php?id=205

It's offical, washing-Machines-live longer-with-Carlgon is second on UKIP's list in the South West.


 No.2866090

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-47963759

Man Wings is getting salty over the Dugdale case…


 No.2866198

File: 6d18ef235a6422a⋯.png (372.76 KB, 1186x590, 593:295, ClipboardImage.png)


 No.2866229

>>2865988

>the type who will never truly understand what it means to struggle and inevitably abandon the cause in exchange for taking their place in the neoliberal status quo.

I never understood this Orwell-tier resentment. Surely the personality and conviction of the person has a role to play as well?


 No.2866252

>>2866229

Perhaps you just didn't understand Orwell. Thats ok a lot of people find him complicated.


 No.2866307

>>2864130

I saw a book in Waterstones a few weeks ago that was trying to make some tenuous fucking link between the Labour Party and the Third Reich


 No.2866457

what the fuck even is zoe williams

i only recognised her by name for the "stop calling blair a war criminal he was good / stop praising castro he was a dictator" contrast image, but i've seen a few not-terrible articles by her as well. (None i can remember off the top of my head, except one that's actually merely quoting someone else saying some great stuff, but still.)


 No.2866460

>Academic Agent tilting towards absolute monarchy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlnNsLj8-LY

In a move that surprised no one


 No.2866462

>>2866457

Jewish feminist author who went to Oxford to study modern history and writes articles for the Guardian. She supported Corbyn for leadership in 2015.


 No.2866471

https://mobile.twitter.com/ElectionMapsUK/status/1118643463380185088

Labour: 33(+1)

Tories: 23(-9)

Brexit Party: 14(+14)

Tories on suicide watch


 No.2866514

File: 8f8884f69602da2⋯.png (87.7 KB, 795x575, 159:115, D4ap3wbXsAAJ0lq.png)

I guess you could say they've Cuked themselves out of this election.


 No.2866518

>>2866460

Tbh look at what Andrew Lilico has been puttting out atm: hes switching between absolute monarchy and republicanism as long as we get brexit.


 No.2866533

>>2866080

>washing-Machines-live longer-with-Carlgon

Nah, last time I tried that, my washing machine broke after it started calling itself "classical liberal"


 No.2866541

>>2865988

>Fuck it when the revolution comes i'm doing a Pol Pot on them wether you lads agree or not. Either them and their ilk will work on the land or they will fertilise the soil.

I see the fully automated luxury communism meme winning more minds than stale 19th century texts.

I wonder if you actually care about improving society or just hate anyone with a southern accent.


 No.2866550

Local elections voting intention, according to @OpiniumResearch

(Changes +/- compared to 2015)

Con 28% (-9%)

Lab 36% (+6%)

LD 10% (+2%)

UKIP 9% (-4%)

Greens 6%

Ind 8%

Other 3%

*Click* Noice.


 No.2866562

File: ee31bac1566541d⋯.png (35.15 KB, 559x566, 559:566, Oh what a night.png)


 No.2866574

File: f9db168e75b00cd⋯.png (431.27 KB, 576x697, 576:697, ClipboardImage.png)

He's not wrong…


 No.2866597

File: 35e441b065dde12⋯.jpg (Spoiler Image, 145.91 KB, 2000x1000, 2:1, Eh Canada.jpg)

>>2866574

Not a brit, I hail from People's Republic of Canuckistan, but curious to know why Labour'd want to 'solve Brexit'? Wasn't it proposed and implemented by a Conservative government, what's in it for them to practically/strategically do anything?


 No.2866605

>>2866550

jesus christ, it's going to be a slaughter if that holds

>>2866562

I can't wait for the Torygraph and Spectator's writers to just completely ignore that euro election poll after breathlessly reporting yougov's

I wonder if the Tories will get desperate enough seeing this nuclear disaster tier numbers to finally oust May, she's going to be worse than Major for them otherwise and self preservation should be kicking in among mps


 No.2866658

>>2866605

The tories can't oust May tho, that's the best part. Tho I expect some tory MPs to defect to FBP after the EU elections because "fuck-it why not?". People like Mark Francois for example.


 No.2866686

>>2864130

Post yfw United Kingdom Federation


 No.2866693

Looks like carlgon is off to a great start

https://metro.co.uk/2019/04/18/utterly-shambolic-start-ukips-eu-election-bid-9248832/

>But when YouTuber Benjamin was asked to explain why he was running as an MEP for Ukip he told journalist: ‘I’m not answering your questions. I’m not apologising for anything you dirty, dirty smear merchants.’

>He added: ‘Get bent,’ and told the room full of journalists: ‘I’m just here to mock the legacy media.’


 No.2866694

>>2866693

The EU should have kicked you out in March.


 No.2866707

Burger here. So let me get this straight Nigel Farage started another party for Brexit that is running against his old one and that new party now is the frontrunner for the European elections while Ukip has about 6% of the vote. Why?


 No.2866736

>>2866707

Because Brexiteers are dense twats.


 No.2866751

File: b31e07245128247⋯.png (473.73 KB, 902x625, 902:625, hajj.png)

>>2866707

farage tried to make it in the USA by pandering to trump and some other shit and seemingly failed abysmally at that so he needs a new job

in the absence of farage, UKIP descended into utter farce pretty quickly. their one hope was paul nuttall winning a seat in a byelection but he royally fucked his chance by getting caught being the world's most chronic liar and didn't help himself by trying to look more working class by growing a creepy beard. after him, i remember a guy named 'hookem' punching somebody out in the eu parliament (lol) and then none of their subsequent leaders. at some point they pivoted towards internet alt-right type weirdos and tommy robinson to the point where even their scottish MEP (notable for telling a journalist he calls a scottish govt minister after abu hamza and for having extreme technical troubles during an attempted live stream of his response to some election debate) resigned over islamophobia in the party. so now they're dragging up the absolute dregs of the earth like sargon to be candidates.

so farage can't join that monetarism tier disaster but he's also nothing but politics and his old party is a mess so he made a new party with a stupid name (i'll eat a crayon if it wasn't suggested by a primary school kid. "what does it support" "brexit" "how about 'the brexit party'")


 No.2866770

>>2866751

Also didn't help that they had a leader literally sign her leadership documents under legal duress and that Paul Nuttall came-off as a right weirdo on the debate stage in 2017.


 No.2866794

File: 33f5773c9fb66d8⋯.jpg (78.81 KB, 750x766, 375:383, D4YfT2jXkAA02h8.jpg)

lol remember when he was a cat


 No.2866804

File: 12dd53aec5bdd8a⋯.jpg (440.06 KB, 1080x1538, 540:769, Screenshot_20190418-150014….jpg)

>>2866751

Must feel bad for carlgon to be betrayed by daddy Nigel


 No.2866810

Blissful thought, if you dwell on it:

The aim of The Independent Group is not to maintain the status quo. That is no longer possible. Their aim is to restore the last 'status quo' that we knew. That status quo is gone, dead, never to be restored. Even if we were to decide to remain in the EU, we've passed the point of no return. Real change is easier than putting humpty dumpy together again.

It follows on from this that we're in another moment of historical flux. You can be pessemistic about that if you want (we could go in a very bad direction), but the reopening of the possibility for change is fundamentally optimistic. If we can change now, we can change again and if progressive forces seem to be on the back-foot now then it's worth looking back at the delusional froth of the right-wing in 70s Britain. From "Labour has won 4 of the 5 previous elections" to 18 years of Tory rule in less time than we've learned it takes to leave the European Union…


 No.2866826

>>2865988

Owen Jones wrote a fine book "the Establishment", but he is a bit of a melt these days and doesn't seem to realise he is part of the establishment as well. The way him and Novara turned their backs on Chris Williamson over "optics" was disgraceful.

If we really want to take a critical marxist perspective, both him and Sarkar are paid hefty sums of money to appear on tv. But what about the nurse or the Teacher who comments on Question Time?

There is a division of labour in british media whereby some people get paid and some don't for the same work.


 No.2866831

>>2866794

Is Brexit Party only gonna run in the European elections? I can somewhat respect them if they do that, at least they are ideologically consistent

>>2866252

Ironic to see the exact same condescension that Orwell was whining about in the middle class socialists from you tbh


 No.2866836

>>2866831

>I can somewhat respect them if they do that, at least they are ideologically consistent

It's just strategy. European Parliament elections are proportional while UK elections are FPTP, meaning small parties without a shot in the UK can gain a lot of influence (relatively) in the European Parliament. This was UKIP's strategy under Farage as well


 No.2866839

>>2866826

>If we really want to take a critical marxist perspective, both him and Sarkar are paid hefty sums of money to appear on tv.

ah yes, the critical "marxist" perspective that any retarded right-winger spews whenever he smells anything vaguely left around him - "commies bitching about capitalism on their iphones"


 No.2866842

>>2866541

Owen Jones is from the North. Sheffield.


 No.2866844

>>2866810

>>2866831

>Is Brexit Party only gonna run in the European elections? I can somewhat respect them if they do that, at least they are ideologically consistent

Farage is a Thatcherite though, Galloway is a deluded sellout.


 No.2866849

>>2866810

Tbh this, too much of the political establishment still thinks it is the 1990s. I face this problem with my father: he says Labour needs to win more swing seats. I ask him what a swing seat is, he says Nuneaton, I tell him Nuneaton voted leave, and he cannot compute that with wanting a second referendum. These people do not realise that what is "swing" or what the centre of this country is has radically shifted.


 No.2866967

>>2866693

The fuck is he doing lmao


 No.2867184

>>2866541

Yes, we should be thankful for the media wreckers who will throw anyone under the bus for their BBC slots winning over social media speds with 2016 reddit memes.

>stale 19th century texts.

Kill yourself liberal, go read the manga if you need something with pictures.

>>2866597

>what's in it for them to practically/strategically do anything?

Literally nothing and nor is there anything they can do. Centrists just can't contain their need to signal.

>>2866839

As opposed to you, the genius Marxist and defender of careerist melts with a red rose slapped on their twitter.

>>2866844

>Galloway is a deluded sellout.

lmao

>>2866967

Engaging in the free market of ideas, of course.


 No.2867192


 No.2867193

>>2867184

Nah tbh when a guy shills for a former investment banker and known Thatcherite totally isnt selljng out.


 No.2867195

>>2867184

Ah, I see you're a member of the London Association of Real Proletarians


 No.2867253

>>2866839

yes we've all seen the memes about "you live in this society". That doesn't mean hypocrisy doesn't exist.

Shows like Question Time are a microcosm of the British state system. People like Jones and Sarkar who go on them but don't criticise and advocate for genuine change to the format are the same as careerist politicians who became MPS and then did fuck all to try and change the state system


 No.2867271

https://www.businessinsider.com/change-uk-chris-leslie-anti-brexit-alliance-will-not-ever-be-likely-2019-4?r=US&IR=T

>Change UK rejects growing calls for electoral alliance with other anti-Brexit parties

The dolts are gonna snuff themselves out before the kindling is lit.


 No.2867273

>>2867271

>Change UK said it had received over 3,700 applications from supporters who want to stand for it in the elections, including figures formerly of the Tories and Labour, plus leading personalities in the pro-EU movement.

They're gonna stand JK Rowling aren't they…


 No.2867274

>>2867271

1. Chuka wants everyone to bend the knee to him like god-emperor macron

2. the other anti-brexit parties like lib dems, greens or snp are unironically to the left of the CUKs and cunts like Leslie will never compromise their economic interests


 No.2867275

File: 5625ef8d8d47d25⋯.jpg (71.9 KB, 597x445, 597:445, 9971d5fe68a3294a7768e95389….jpg)

>>2866831

A condescending question deserves a condescending answer.

>Surely the personality and conviction of the person has a role to play as well?

The personality and conviction of a person is shaped by their parents, upbringing and peers. Factors such as class absolutely have an impact. Middle class urban children benefit from the status quo. They might flirt with socialism when they have university debts and whinge about not being able to afford a home while renting a flat in a trendy gentrified part of London. That flirtation ends when they get the well paid job in the city and buy a house in Surrey. Orwell saw the lack of dedication among the upper-middle class socialist circles he inhabited. I've observed it among the middle class children of Thatcher and its evidently even more pronounced among the children of Blair. They are neoliberal to the core and will abandon socialism as soon as life affords them the opportunity which is almost inevitable given the circumstances of their middle class upbringing. The likes of Owen Jones and Ash Sakar have no honest convictions and neither do their supporters. As for personality they are a soulless void. I'd rather do just about anything other than hang out with them having champagne bubble baths.


 No.2867276

>>2867275

>A condescending question deserves a condescending answer.

That 'no u' deflection was pretty pathetic. I asked a honest question only to get a needlessly hostile answer from you.

You and like Orwell before have a lot of conjecture but no real concrete examples of such people. (IIRC someone brought up the Cambridge Five to disprove Orwell's cynicism). Hell even Jones and Sakar still support socialism (or at least pretend to) even after making it. To assume that their specific class upbringing has made inequivocally toxic and irredeemable is fatalist. Especially now when the middle class is disappearing and these people are unlikely to get out of their poverty.

This needless hostility and cynicism towards imperfect allies gets nobody anywhere and is peak wrecker mentality.


 No.2867278

>>2867192

lmao its about time


 No.2867281

>>2867274

Tbh a part of this is also Londoner arrogance: they expect the SNP to join them "because Europe" because they just see them as a liberal party in Scotland rather than as a separatist force.

But there's also the fact that the lib dems are a big org, they have over 100k members now and have secure representation in local and devolved government; along with an ally party in Norn. They aren't just gonna be annexed like the liberals of the 1980s.

Also also, the Green membership are basically hippies: they're not gonna take lightly to libcons like the CUKs.

On a totally different note, rewatching the BBC Robin Hood from the early 00s, and there's a bit where Robin Hood advocates basically against income taxes but taxing trade instead. Is this mutualism in action?


 No.2867294

>>2867281

Historically, the greens have been a grassroots party where the leadership get 1 vote on policy decisions, the same as any other rank & file member.

Many of the traditionally green hippies have moved to Labour, and the Greens had a surge of ex libdem members last year. They've also suddenly received lots of big donations. These all suggest the Greens might not behave like they have in the past.

The biggest change to the Green Party (and the reason I left) was a change to its constitution made at the autumn conference last year, essentially moving all the power in the party to an unelected 'board' with a toothless elected 'oversight committee'.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Greens move towards being another awful centrist liberal party in the near future, maybe even an alliance with the CUKs. They already seem to be campaigning more for remain than ecosocialism.


 No.2867296

>Republican group Saoradh say 'Republican Volunteer' was 'defending the people' after murder of journalist in Derry

https://www.derrynow.com/news/republican-group-saoradh-say-republican-volunteer-defending-people-murder-journalist-derry/275585

Holy fucking shit. Fuck these cunts.


 No.2867301

>>2867294

Have Labour itself adopted a more Green-style policies? Or even Lib Dems?


 No.2867305

>>2867294

While people like Lucas and Sian Berry are at the top though, the Greens will continue to be a left-wing party. The thing with the shift of various European Green parties to the centre is that it is a result of conservative green movements (which the UK kinda lacks) moving into these parties, and/or the merging with existing agrarian parties (which the UK hasn't had since the 1920s). So the existing infrastructure for the Greens to turn into centrist-twerps isn't there, and the leadership; while agonisingly pro-European, still maintains a leftist outlook, for now.

>>2867301

Honestly the 2017 manifesto was kinda weak on environmental issues; but there are now there are movements towards forming a cohesive programme along the "Green New Deal" paradigm.


 No.2867333

>>2867296

Personally I don't feel any sympathy for her death as a result of occupational hazard when her and the establishment she sought to represent couldn't give a damn about workers who die and are seriously injured every day in the UK as a result of their occupation. The Buzzfeed vulture escorted the police in a raid on a Republican estate where people don't recognise the authority of the PSNI and she got caught in the middle. She knowingly put herself in that situation and if it were someone else's corpse on the ground last night you can bet she would exploit it for propaganda purposes. This killing is a repercussion for her actions wether inadvertent or not and I don't care if that sounds harsh. Perhaps she was naive and unaware that the police would use her as a human shield but as a supposed journalist entering a riot in a war zone she should have known better. The reports out of Londonderry in recent years have made it clear that the Troubles never went away they simply went underground and have resurfaced in a series of violent and chaotic confrontations in recent months. I'm not a journalist, a republican or even Northern Irish so as I was aware of it then she damn well should have been. Honestly it won't surprise me to discover that the police intentionally left her out as a sitting duck in a doublecross of sorts for their own propaganda purposes. I see they have already branded the shooting a terrorist incident. If i'm correct we will no doubt have to wait a few decades before the truth of the matter is exposed, as a coverup will now be in full effect. Politically the most interesting thing about this incident is that Saoradh are effectively replacing the redundant Sinn Fein in the Republican struggle.


 No.2867367

>>2867333

>She had it coming because she was actually keeping the PSNI accountable

What the actual fuck kind of brain do you have to have to think that makes any sense.


 No.2867374

>>2867367

>The PSNI take silly girls from the press out for a ride along so she can hold them to account

Yeah right. Grow up kid. She played with fire and got burned. She did have it coming and good riddance to her.


 No.2867377

>>2867374

Honestly this makes no sense, you would rather the police in this country went around without the press looking over their shoulder? That's exactly how Good Friday happened: no public accountability for the apperatues of the state. Supporting the fact this woman got shot for doing something that actually helps prevent police abuse is fucking dense.


 No.2867378

I walked past the radio and heard them talking about the protests in london, the presenter was trying to throw shade on it as they usually do with protests. "People will miss their doctor's appointments!", "People are dying", yadda yadda.

Then they finally get on to proposed "solutions" and the very first thing the fucking presenter said was limiting the birth rate of certain people.

Like what the fuck man? Do they not even bother hiding their fascist shit anymore?


 No.2867380

>>2867378

This was BBC radio for anyone interested. Normally I hear this nonsense on LBC.


 No.2867382

>>2867275

That picture is the very same irony the alt-right uses to "cover" for the reality of their nature.


 No.2867385

What would you do if in 10 years Britain becomes fascist and Sargon was appointed as leader of the party in charge?


 No.2867386

>>2867385

Move to Russia, set-up a proper English pub. Live out my days in exile.


 No.2867422

>>2867377

If you want to discuss a matter like the troubles then stop being naive and overly sensitive. She wasn't holding the police to account or preventing abuse, she was needlessly agitating where she didn't belong in order to profit and advance her career. If she were a proper journalist she would have kept her distance during the event, simply observing the actors involved and not getting in the middle of it. This morning she would have gone to talk to witnesses, gathering mobile phone evidence of what had occurred and exposing it to the public. If she were an honest journalist she would be alive today. Instead she went for a police ride along to the front lines in order to serve as a state mandated propagandist. She was a selfish bitch and if you want to shed a tear go right ahead but don't expect everyone to agree.

>That's exactly how Good Friday happened: no public accountability for the apperatues of the state.

If the event you were attempting to reference was Bloody Sunday then that was the best thing that happened for the Republicans in the 20th century even if they will never admit it. That is the true nature of war. As for the Good Friday agreement it was and remains an absolute farce. It's not worth the paper it was written on and the sooner its thrown into the rubbish bin of history, along with the rest of the Blair years, the better.


 No.2867439

>>2867422

Honestly your entire argument is schizo: one minute she is an agent of the establishment, next she is bad at her job by closely following the police, the next she is agitating, and then she is selfishly advancing her career. You're just trying to justify a senseless, needless, and justification-less murder. But she was a prod so I guess it's alright.

You're not a socialist, you're a braindead nationalist. Your thinking is no better than when zionists justify an IDF sniper shooting a Journalist on the Gazan side.


 No.2867463

>>2867439

She was paid to agitate on behalf of the state and she was bad at her job. She wasn't following the police, she was with the police. That is a significant difference. I've gathered your reading comprehension is subpar and you attempt to use insults in lieu of presenting an argument but you couldn't be more wrong about me or my motivations. I am an English socialist, a protestant and a unionist. I respect Irish nationalists as a worthy foe but I most certainly do not support their cause. Her death was technically an accident, collateral damage, however she got what she deserved regardless. There is nothing to justify because she chose to take the road that ended her life. If you want further replies on this subject you really need to become better versed in the history of the troubles and detach yourself from emotions about the dead cunt.

And for the record there is nothing about Israel that I support.


 No.2867554

>>2867193

It's a single issue party you tribalistic grug.

>>2867195

>Owen Jones and Ash Sarkar are the REAL leftists

>Galloway, however, is not

>If you disagree with this incredibly London student union take, you are actually the Londoner

You dumb rose.

>>2867276

My problem with Jones is that he flip flops every day and Sarkar less so, but is still a weak hypocritical idpoller. She was outraged and caved to pressure over Williamson but is now getting butthurt over the exact same thing happening to Ilhan Omar and is justifying her hypocrisy by calling the attacks Islamophobic, racist, etc.

Chris Williamson did nothing wrong.

>>2867378

It's darkly comical how many people jump to depopulation and state birth control, it's codger support for national service all over again. There are numerous holistic things that can be done but people don't want to give up their burgers and combustion cars (two things I admittedly will miss).

>>2867463

>D I R E C T R U L E


 No.2867575

File: ba2c85901b950fe⋯.jpg (39.31 KB, 640x480, 4:3, homer laugh.jpg)

>>2867554

>objected to the 'London' in 'London Association of Real Proletarians'

Forgive my slight, you're clearly not a mere member, you're definitely on committee.

who'd you vote for in 2015 then


 No.2867594

>>2867575

>being this assblasted at leaving the EU

Oh rosey, no!

>who'd you vote for in 2015 then

2014 EU: UKIP

2015 GE: Green

2016 REF: Remain

2017 GE: Labour

Get on my level. Will be voting BXP soon :^)


 No.2867595

>>2867594

what have you got against the house of lancaster you twat


 No.2867601

>>2867554

>My problem with Jones is that he flip flops every day and Sarkar less so, but is still a weak hypocritical idpoller. She was outraged and caved to pressure over Williamson but is now getting butthurt over the exact same thing happening to Ilhan Omar and is justifying her hypocrisy by calling the attacks Islamophobic, racist, etc.

>Chris Williamson did nothing wrong.

Based and correct take. I'd go much further with Jones and say that he's a complete wrecker though, he hasn't really made any big shifts from his past actions and his careerism is eventually going to lead him to a point where he will attempt to betray people. As much as I think Ash is hopped up on Racial Consciousness "I'm an anti-racist before I'm a communist" and all that jazz, she at least has actual convictions and a broad history of organizing & political activism learned in part from her family


 No.2867609

>>2867554

>It's a single issue party you tribalistic grug.

No, it's a single person party: that person being a former investment banker and known Thatcherite. This is "vote the SNP so we get Scottish Socialism" tier.


 No.2867613

Also tbh the two best left commentators atm are Eddie Dempsey and Paul Embery.

Made by Trade Unionist Gang.


 No.2867614

>>2867609

>This is "vote the SNP so we get Scottish Socialism" tier.

Fucking lol, what a terrible strawman. The remainers fully intend to use the EU elections as a second referendum and there is no downside to voting for Farage's party besides it upsetting your sensibilities because he's a cunt.


 No.2867617

>>2867614

No it is the same, voting for a "single issue party" and putting something tangential to socialism above the actual socialist movement itself.


 No.2867620

File: df010ad6d0c55d4⋯.png (2.39 MB, 1600x900, 16:9, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2867617

>No it is the same


 No.2867622

lmao at tribalistic as an insult


 No.2867624

>>2867554

>My problem with Jones is that he flip flops every day and Sarkar less so, but is still a weak hypocritical idpoller. She was outraged and caved to pressure over Williamson but is now getting butthurt over the exact same thing happening to Ilhan Omar and is justifying her hypocrisy by calling the attacks Islamophobic, racist, etc.

Then your grievances are with their methods not their convictions. I do agree that they are pretty shit about the Chris fiasco.


 No.2867626

File: 5ac409555078f91⋯.png (633.83 KB, 674x897, 674:897, 5ac409555078f9130ee0f17891….png)

>>2867554

>>D I R E C T R U L E


 No.2867636

>>2867622

Tbh this, "Tribalist" is a big brain centrist insult.

Also tbh Chris Williamson is more of a liability than an asset.


 No.2867643

>>2867622

>>2867636

>picking apart language to justify remaining in the EU and throwing people under the bus

How many layers of ideological bankruptcy are you on, my guys?


 No.2867648

vote conservative to deliver brexit and own the radlibs


 No.2867668

>>2867643

>if you are slightly against or even critique me, you must be a Remoaner libtard!

As toxic and purity testing as the #FBPE crowd


 No.2867675

>>2867668

lol, now who's the centrist?


 No.2867677

File: 51547c5617b7f3e⋯.jpg (21.06 KB, 349x340, 349:340, SARGON.jpg)

Im going to vote UKIP for a laugh. Whats the worst that could happen?


 No.2867679

>>2867675

toxicity and purity testing transcends political boundaries


 No.2867683

>>2867677

>voting for the tommeh/carlgon neo-bnp party

just jump off a bridge for a laugh instead cunt


 No.2867688

>>2867683

Found the American.


 No.2867698

File: bb883923c608d7e⋯.jpg (225.76 KB, 1024x678, 512:339, gettyimages-518845115-1024….jpg)

vote SDP in the upcoming european elections or on results night you will find bill rodgers in your kitchen using your condiments to write his name on the floor


 No.2867710

File: 1462f1d65c73b8a⋯.png (157.88 KB, 316x316, 1:1, ClipboardImage.png)

>Today, Saturday the 24th of September 2016, we a significant collective of Irish Republican activists, who for a number of years have acted autonomously, have after a number of years of debate, consultation and organisation today in Ard Fheis organised, constituted and launched a Revolutionary Irish Republican Party, the Party's name is Saoradh.

>Saoradh believes that Ireland should be governed by the Irish People with the wealth and wealth producing mechanisms in the ownership of the Irish People. This can not happen while British imperialism undemocratically retains control of Irish destinies and partitions our nation, this cannot happen while a neo-colonial elite in a subservient supposed indigenous administration sell’s the nation’s labour and natural resources to international capital.

>Saoradh does not believe that British imperialism or capitalist exploitation can be confronted in the structures they have created to consolidate their undemocratic control of the Irish nation. As such we believe any assembly claiming to speak for the Irish People without being elected by the united people of the Irish nation to be illegal. Saoradh will seek to organise and work with the Irish People rather than be consumed and usurped by the structures of Ireland’s enemy's,

>Standing on a long and proud revolutionary Irish Republican history of resistance, inspired by the actions and words of Tone of Connolly, of Mellows, of Costello and of Sands, upholding the founding documents of our forefathers – the 1916 proclamation, the declaration of independence and the democratic programme of the first Dáil, Saoradh hereby declares its commitment to the unfinished revolution, the liberation of Ireland and the social emancipation of the Irish People.

Are they /ourguys/?


 No.2867713

>>2867613

Paul Embery is meh but has a lot of interesting stuff to say about Brexit and pointing out the issues within the Labour party were it comes to working class people. Eddie Dempsey is solid and could with time become Bob Crow tier


 No.2867735

>>2867710

Depends on their policy toward the EU.


 No.2867738

>>2867735

I think it's got to the stage where the Irish are like the French, they'll just carry on with any excuse, unified Ireland or not. Pretty based.


 No.2867765

File: 958cc467ce232e3⋯.jpg (67.95 KB, 633x699, 211:233, 1555709921385.jpg)

File: 0cf8e00a6485ce8⋯.jpg (33.13 KB, 632x385, 632:385, 1555709954087.jpg)

lol big Di busted for having a cheeky mojito on the train


 No.2867773

>>2867765

This is probably the most normal thing I've ever seen Diane do.


 No.2867821

>>2867765

What else are you meant to do on the train other than drink?


 No.2867847

>>2867773

Agreed. Usually she's not my cup of tea but drinking on the overground is relatable.

>>2867821

I suppose she could read a book but its a sunny good Friday so I don't think she will lose any votes over this. Maybe the muslims but the blacks and the hipsters won't care.


 No.2867850

>>2867821

opiods


 No.2867873

>>2867765

Hol' up, drinking is illegal on the tube?

The fuck?


 No.2867875

>>2867873

Yeah, TFL only. You're good literally everywhere else in the country. Got told to knock it off by the BTP when I was down there and was like u wot m8?


 No.2867915

>>2867873

National rail you're good but when it's more local stuff it can be a problem. You're usually fine though as long as you're not being "rowdy" or whatever.


 No.2869747

>>2867765

Sun confirmed for the no fun police


 No.2869867

>>2867765

This has made my feelings on her go from 5/10 to a solid 8/10, what a lad


 No.2870062

And they've found Carlgon being an actual fucking racist.

https://twitter.com/sundersays/status/1119515788485042179

>>2867765

+rep tbh.


 No.2870179


 No.2870187

God I wish that The Last Leg was still on at the moment XD


 No.2870301

>>2870179

His weird obsession with Jess Phillips is finally coming to haunt him.

I mean fuck Jess Phillips, but fuck Carl more.


 No.2870431

>>2870301

>I mean fuck Jess Phillips

Don't mind if I do, consensually of course, rape is bad after all


 No.2870466

>>2870431

I mean nah, but whatever floats your boat.


 No.2870483

>>2867601

>where he will attempt to betray people.

He's already doing this. Williamson, Walker, Wadsworth (no I don't know they all have names beginning with W) have all being thrown under the bus by him.


 No.2870761

Saoradh marched through Dublin today, for basically no reason.

In other news there have been 4 ATM machines robbed in the last 24 hrs.

The Dissos are fucking going to launch a full-on campaign.


 No.2870775

>>2870761

Good, tbh. The Tories need to learn a lesson. Hopefully Saoradh can keep it in their pants and not kill civilians.


 No.2870779

>>2870775

They've already killed a civie, this is going to be bloody.

Also they managed to get Arlene Foster gain support in a Republican community so I hope they're happy with themselves.


 No.2870780

>>2870779

Yeah I know, it's hard work living in a morally bankrupt world. I'm far away from being a moralist but it hurts to know there's no grounding in reality, just shooting, stabbing, and assassination. Have we lost the plot?


 No.2870822

>>2870780

Tbh Republicans have had shit praxis for decades: "Oh yes let's start a bombing campaign just before WWII with German Help" "Oh yes let's start a bombing campaign during WWII just after the US has entered" "Oh yes let's launch a bombing campaign under no real pretext" "oh yes let's derail the support gained by the NICRC by bombing civies in mainland Britain.

But a lot of the random lone wolf stuff comes a great sense of lost control. When you feel you have no agency over your own life, lashing out in such a destructive manner makes more sense since it feels like you have more control.


 No.2870846

>>2870822

It made sense at the start and got the gov around the table, but now it's starting to look like late USSR or modern RF, there's just no point to it and things are blowing up because we need X done to achieve Z, even if it takes a pile of bodies. Z is never achieved and it's all about X itself, cynically, it's just based on old praxis, the point is the action, and the outcome doesn't matter, it's just various states lying to you, nobody cares about X or Z. Not sure if this makes sense and isn't just based on my fear that everything is geopolitical and nothing means anything anymore, mind.

What I'm trying to say is that I have a very deep seated fear that everything is pointless and the modern world has been stripped of all reason to the point that there's no point doing anything, no matter how radical. Everything we do is utterly pointless until a total economic collapse that drags the whole world in. The future is horrifying to me, and the real fear is that there is nothing to stop it.


 No.2870875

>>2870846

>It made sense at the start and got the gov around the table

It really didn't though, the "bombing lead to talks" argument makes no sense. The reason the British gov went to the table was because Maggie got thrown out of office and while Major was a bit shit he also wanted peace in norn. The bombing campaign only killed any support for the NICRM that existed in GB and that had been so carefully cultivated.


 No.2871061

File: 3d68bb0044dcd30⋯.png (382.66 KB, 750x1001, 750:1001, ClipboardImage.png)

What the fuck?


 No.2871218

>>2870062

Nobody inclined to vote for UKIP cares about accusations of racism anymore. Cuck nigel is gone and has taken his Tories with him

>>2870431

I'd love to hate fuck jess. I imagine slamming her from on top, choking her out as she makes donkey noises. Have you ever heard the noise a donkey makes while being fucked? Its loud and wild and thats the dumb brummy donkey noise jess will make as I penetrate her deeper with every stroke. Id spit on her ugly face while she loses consciousness. Then id slap her red all over until she comes too just in time to take my load…

consensually of course..


 No.2871249

File: 866d34ad97bcc1d⋯.jpg (47.99 KB, 858x536, 429:268, D3ExfXyXQAAR_xP.jpg)

>>2871230

>Leftist

BE GONE YANK


 No.2871250

>>2871218

>Nobody inclined to vote for UKIP cares about accusations of racism anymore. Cuck nigel is gone and has taken his Tories with him

Eh UKIP actually having a major member espouse "scientific racism" will radically delegitimise them (which is what Nige worked so hard to achieve, legitimacy). UKIP going full BNP will only serve to kill them.


 No.2871259

File: 3a8d7b464d68018⋯.jpg (289.72 KB, 1024x1365, 1024:1365, ChriSoc.jpg)

Happy Easter btw lads.


 No.2871260

>>2871255

You will be granted free meds for your schizophrenia after the revolution


 No.2871328

>>2871218

Hahaha fuck me HEEHAW HEEHAW

>>2871255

B E G O N E


 No.2871329

>>2870875

historically illiterate trash, Thatcher signed onto the Anglo Irish Agreement within months of the Brighton bombing. Violence in Ireland only escalated *after* the NICRA and other protest groups started getting gunned down in the streets, without the impetus of violence there was zero political will to properly engage with the endemic social problems and every time that those problems were addressed can be directly tied to a dissident paramilitary campaign.


 No.2871850

>>2871061

I mean, a broken clock is right at least twice a day.

>>2871255

Yeah, because the current government is leftist...


 No.2871963

>>2870761

>for basically no reason

Easter Rising


 No.2871966

>>2870822

>NICRC

>>2870875

>NICRM

It's called the NICRA for fuck's sake


 No.2872200

File: 0ef76a2aa753eeb⋯.png (327.78 KB, 1200x642, 200:107, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2871963

It was the day before, on the Saturday. My bad.

>>2871966

That was the name of the org, but the movement or campaign itself was what I was referring to.

In other news, a majority of tory members are gonna vote for Farage in the EU elections…


 No.2872242

>>2872200

The torygraph has an article where several local tory associations have essentially boycotted the conservatives for the european election

I suspect they're going to get a worse slaughter than polls suggest because how many people are going to drag themselves to a european election vote fucking tory?


 No.2872251

>>2872242

This is gonna make the Bermondsey by-election look like 1997 holy hell.

There's also the important feature that if the Brexit party do well (whether it is come first or second to Labour), that tory politicians might jump-ship to FBP or another outfit. People are quick to predict the death of parties, but honestly this is some terminal stuff.


 No.2872268

>>2872200

UKIP are literally BTFO at this point tbh, they can't even get any of the CON voters.


 No.2872281

https://twitter.com/DawnHFoster/status/1120353979312029701

Holy shit Alan Sugar doesn't actually understand how tax works.


 No.2872282

>>2872268

Tbh hadn't actually clocked that.


 No.2872291

Best part of all this is Sargon boasting about the rallies he's been holding and unironically calling it the UKIP World Tour, vote UKIP to save the world, and other autism.


 No.2872301


 No.2872308

File: f242b2003872241⋯.png (48.99 KB, 666x650, 333:325, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 68c024792cd73f5⋯.png (35.09 KB, 668x464, 167:116, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 732693d05218d68⋯.png (43.34 KB, 669x598, 669:598, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 2af7e6bb6dfcde7⋯.png (12.87 KB, 650x214, 325:107, ClipboardImage.png)

>tfw you make the mistake of reading the SPGB program while browsing for parties that are reasonably near you

How the fuck has this breed of hyper-sectarian Kautskyism survived to the 21st century?


 No.2872351

>>2872268

That's because the Brexit Party is doing a very good job of posing as a single-issue 'stick it to the EU' party. That means Tories can vote for it without feeling disloyal. In reality the BXP has loads of ideological baggage. Farage has said 'there is no difference between the Brexit party and Ukip in terms of policy'. The only difference is that UKIP has embraced fascist loonies into the party while BXP has kept its distance.

>>2872281

This is not surprising. I remember seeing him get owned by Donald Trump of all people on Twitter.

>>2872301

Honestly I'm surprised that May has got off so lightly the last couple of weeks. She's broken all her promises and hasn't told anyone what her plan for the future is (if she even has one). I wonder if she's planning just to run down the clock again and try bullying her deal through in October.


 No.2872362

>>2872351

>in reality the BXP has loads of ideological baggage

Yeah but these are only the EU elections, they will make no difference at all on domestic policy in the UK, so there is literally no downside to voting for the BXP. They will never enact any of their domestic agenda. Clearly in the next general election I will vote Labour, because policy actually matters here. A vote for the BXP is a way to say 'fuck you' to the remainiac establishment and remind them that we still want out. This is the biggest opportunity for a protest vote we will likely ever get, so fuck it.

https://www.rt.com/op-ed/457228-farage-galloway-vote-elections-eu/

George Galloway has a good article on this.

I'm not the other BXP supporter btw


 No.2872373

>>2872362

Are there not going to be any Lexit candidates though? No2EU might be dead but you'd think there'd be somebody putting the case forward this time.


 No.2872406

>>2872373

Not really known atm, I imagine some rando trot party like the WRP will stand but outside of that nah.


 No.2872430

File: 3e8415d44adf5f3⋯.png (332.54 KB, 680x403, 680:403, ClipboardImage.png)

Fucking hell, the Dissos have really fucked up.




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