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/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

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The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

File: 0f6028efdbc86ad⋯.jpg (130.83 KB, 635x794, 635:794, moses01.jpg)

0f7904  No.520608[Reply]

Glory to God in the highest!

You can continue discussion with others,as well as reach the mod team on our Discord server! -> https://discord.gg/BsS8Vwd

As a rule, we do not partner with any other website or server. If someone is claiming to be partnered with this board or our discord server, disregard any such claim.

You can reach the board owner at this email: tutorNC@protonmail.com

This board is for fellowship and discussion among Christians. Please be mindful that some general rules are enforced to encourage constructive discourse.

Please read the rules and ban policy before posting!

Rules

1. This board is strictly Safe For Work.

Please consult the global rule page if this is not clear.

2. Interactions must be for the sake of Charity. Post made in the spirit of disruption or spite could earn you a short to permanent ban.

Charity is a foundational concept in Christianity. It is the virtue of supreme love for God and others. It is the greatest of the three virtues Paul emphasizes, and governs all Christian conduct. Just because this is an 8chan board does not alleviate Christians of their moral duty. All interactions must be done with this in mind.

This includes all antagonism. Personal insults, trolling, disrupting/derailing a thread, raiding from other boards, spamming, and scandal are all considered part of this rule.

Scandal includes encouraging people to commit sin like fornication, masturbation, blasphemy, apostasy, abortion, lying, taking the Lords name in vain, suicide, and the like. Any esoteric topics will fall under this as well.

Interdenominational debates are allowed on this board, but they are still governed by charity. InsinuatiPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

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90ac63  No.785211

Hey, mods.

Sorry for wilding out during this week. I had a really bad manic and psychotic breakdown.

I'm still not doing so very well but I'm sober enough to post this at least.

You have permabanned me on my usual computer and on my phone, as well as from the discord server. That is fine.

I ask you to not ban me from this computer though. I can only be on this IP once every 2-3 weekends, and considering that I got myself banned from literally every other place I used to belong to, it would be nice to at least have this one place to talk to people once every few weeks.

I also say this because, well, if you judge it proper to ban me from this IP too, then go ahead. I'm not going to secretly post here if you intend to permanently remove me in every way.

Please pray for me either way, though. I'm not the one holding the commands and I don't know what to do but observe.




File: d080038c6654a33⋯.jpg (185.99 KB, 900x600, 3:2, argentine church.jpg)

99a16f  No.491187[Reply]

Didn't see a qtddtot in the catalog, so I'm creating one. I'll start it off with this question. Is sodomy between a man and a woman sinful?

299 posts and 49 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

ba19df  No.785735

>>785723

In the NT, the promise is perfected, the material gains of this world are de-emphasized (because they have already been fulfilled in the accomplishments of the Mosaic Israel) and the eternal rewards of Heaven are promised.

There is no duel-covenant, the latter promise that arrives with Christ is better than the old.

There is no longer Jew or Gentile, the basis of the saved no longer pertains to blood, or citizenship of a physical, earthly, Mosaic Israel, but belongs to all of mankind; and the citizenship is in Heaven, which will be eternal.




File: 6551fde33670992⋯.jpg (97.84 KB, 736x736, 1:1, 7706d710a28e1903e239b3a2e6….jpg)

c038c2  No.405648[Reply]

27 You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. Matthew 5:27-28

19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 1 Corinthians 6:19

8 Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. Galatians 6:8

Post your Purity successes/woes/prayer requests/ etc.

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8815fa  No.785757

>>785641

Thank you, brother anon. I'll be announcing further milestones to help keep morale up.




File: 121666695b2d721⋯.png (133.04 KB, 258x258, 1:1, 1b00ba2cf2493b5621a21179a0….png)

bc249d  No.508486[Reply]

>What is this thread?

The designated political discussion thread. Christians from all parts of the political spectrum are encouraged to discuss relevant political topics and ideas, as well as ask questions and hopefully recieve answers from all points of view. Anything related to politics that doesn't actively involve the Catholic/Orthodox/Protestant churches should go here, so if a politics thread is deleted, this thread is the reason why.

As a reminder:

All board rules apply to this thread, so keep things civil.

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cb522a  No.785764

>>785094

He could have been just a nut who wanted his fool brand of accelerationism to get a boost.




File: 0f5c438ddb221b0⋯.jpg (124.66 KB, 1024x1536, 2:3, the-infant-samuel-at-praye….jpg)

dfad1c  No.353817[Reply]

“But I have prayed for you, that your faith would not fail. And you, when you have turned back, strengthen your brethren.”

Luke 22:32

Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition with thanksgiving, let your requests be known to God. And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your thoughts in Christ Jesus.

Philippians 4:6-7

Confess your offences to one another and pray for one another in order to be healed. The insistent prayer of a righteous person is powerfully effective!

James 5:16

299 posts and 43 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

7878ff  No.785650

>>785594

{10:28} And Peter began to say unto him: Behold, we have left all things and have followed thee.

{10:29} Jesus answering said: Amen I say to you, there is no man who hath left house or brethren or sisters or father or mother or children or lands, for my sake and for the gospel,

{10:30} Who shall not receive an hundred times as much, now in this time: houses and brethren and sisters and mothers and children and lands, with persecutions: and in the world to come life everlasting.

Hang in there, pilgrim. Jesus never said this journey would be easy. I'll keep you and your family in my prayers.




YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

5768ed  No.776528[Reply]

>Moloch worship isn't rea-

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388903  No.783082

File: 9bcacca569f1e99⋯.jpg (39.15 KB, 500x636, 125:159, b8eadbda337f0b369443bdb967….jpg)

>>783081

>advocating people pray makes me a LARPer

I'll just assume you tagged the wrong post and continue to pray the rosary.


7ff8d9  No.783395

File: 1dde141b70ad0f0⋯.jpg (452.69 KB, 1113x1503, 371:501, Djei537XoAADOMg.jpg)

>>783082

Sorry, I did tag the wrong post continue doing what you're doing brother.


18f8ee  No.785755

>>783395

>luminous mysteries


d5dad7  No.785760

I would love to kill these people, because it's what the deserve, but it would be purely out of anger and vengeance if I did. Hopefully there is a TV in heaven that let's you watch them being tortured in hell by demon cocks. I want to watch them suffer


5a8e8b  No.785771

>>785760

I understand being abhorred by evil but judge nothing before the time. I am sure that the anger God feels knowing and loving the child infinitely more than you and me is on another level. So let him decide what to do.




File: f4495047d8c1589⋯.jpg (177.74 KB, 500x375, 4:3, f4495047d8c1589b67ded28b10….jpg)

993bf5  No.785640[Reply]

The person you just got done arguing with……………………… would you wash the feet of that person?

3 posts and 1 image reply omitted. Click reply to view.

ea17be  No.785666

>>785640

The very most recent person? Yes, they were a clear cut case of misguided but sincere.

Nevertheless, I sense that the subtext of your question is "Would you wash the feet of a person that you had a truly nasty, rancorous argument with, and who you honestly can't stand?" The last one who I truly experienced this with, I can say yes, at this point, but only due to time. One of my biggest crosses to bear is that though it is easy for me to pray for others of questionable character if their actions have not affected me personally, if I have been affected personally by someone's whose actions, in the large scheme of things, are not nearly as severe, I can hold a grudge for a long time before it begins to heal and subside over time. Being able to wash the feet of someone who I was truly angry and bitter towards shortly after such an argument would be a great challenge for me. Something that I have to sincerely work on and pray about.


4cf221  No.785669

the tradition of washing the feet was to wash the feet of fellow christian men, not any old stranger you get into an argument with or otherwise. stop misusing tradition.


688c00  No.785671

>>785665

Pretty much the same here. Not really boastful. I just don't argue. If someone's wrong, I'll tell them I think they're wrong; but if they don't see that they're wrong, I just shrug and move on. It always seemed pointless to me to argue with someone who thinks 1+1=3. Unless it's my own child whose education for which I am responsible, then I stop after showing the person that 1+1=2. If they still think it's 3, that's not really my concern. I shake the dust off and move on.


06d35d  No.785739


2b4b95  No.785770

>>785640

No because I only argue with filthy heretics. I would rather wash the feet of an agnostic normie fornicator




File: 814d3f3314ae98b⋯.jpg (117.8 KB, 899x943, 899:943, Christian-and-Gay.jpg)

42b145  No.785546[Reply]

Why do so many modern Christians subscribe to this cancerous neo-Marxist perversion? These same people also claim that rule of law doesn't exist - "God will punish them", so therefore it absolves us of any responsibility to stop tolerating evil among us. These people are also pro-immigration and pro-race mixing and strongly believe that we should have to tolerate the increasing crime that these people bring. I suspect these are the same people who also tolerate open gays in the church. Does God not show himself in his works? If your cities are becoming filled with crime and your community is breaking down, is this not indicative of your wrong-doing?

Here are some of the passages they love to quote

>Leviticus 19:33 - And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not vex him.

They neglect to mention that a sojourn is a temporary visitor, a tourist.

>Matthew 22:39 - Thou shalt love thy neighbor

But they ALWAYS omit "as thyself". I hold myself to a certain standard of behavior, I expect the same for others.

>Galatians 3:27 - For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ

>Galatians 3:28 - There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus

Most of these problem people have not been baptized. Furthermore, this does not pertain to rule of law. Man and woman are one in Christ but we know the Bible states the woman is subordinate to the man. By this same reasoning we can conclude it also does not apply to law of race.

Now I have some I would like to present

>2 Thessalonians 3:11 - For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.

No welfare parasites. God helps those who help themselves.

>Matthew 6:24 - No one can serve two masters. For you will hate one and love the other; you will be devoted to one and despise the othPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

19 posts and 2 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

33422e  No.785691

File: 39d20f4b2ba7af5⋯.jpg (216.82 KB, 567x599, 567:599, 567px-Christ_Pantocrator_m….jpg)

I've spoken with a well known psychologist who is also a professor with a doctorate at my university. He deals with homosexuals and lesbians. He told me that there is no "gay gene", or that homos are born homos, but that they "become" homos due to their environment and the people they hang around, with family factoring in. Apparently once straight young boys become homosexuals if they are abused or if they lack a strong father figure at home. He has cured men of these afflictions, and has got them to "become" heterosexuals "again". He did so by having these homosexuals join these groups comprised of men and women, where they are then loved, not sexually or the way we are all familiar with (thanks, liberalism), but the sort of love two men in the army who have seen combat have with each other. The sort of love that bonds two or more men together. He told me that after a few (or more, depends on the person and their case) sessions, the once homosexual "reverted" and started to have feelings towards women.

As for lesbians, he told me that the women he dealt with were lesbians for the sake of it; they rebelled. If I'm not mistaken, he told me that lesbians were easier to "fix", as compared to homosexuals, for a reason I don't know of. He did so by introducing these lesbians to a woman older than them/more mature than them, so that these lesbians would have a strong mother figure in their life. Once these lesbians spent time with these strong mother figures, they were cured of their afflictions.


27c8bd  No.785693

>>785691

It's easier for "lesbians" because they're literally built to be mothers, they desire husbands even to the pains of child-birth, as Scripture says.

to be more crass, most ugly lesbians are either pseudo-men, or if attractive, "bisexual" at worst.


33422e  No.785694

>>785693

I see. Thanks, anon.


235a64  No.785743

>>785583

The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:

2 Peter 2:9


b0b788  No.785769




File: 928a72e9cb6f133⋯.jpeg (2.18 MB, 4032x3024, 4:3, 62680AFB-D38E-49A3-9369-2….jpeg)

c07595  No.784835[Reply]

Hello /Christian/,

I am an Anglican from birth and was baptised an Anglican by my parents, but have not really started thinking seriously about faith and salvation until recently.

My question to this board, is whether I should develop my faith within my Anglican home and church l, or whether I should convert to Catholicism? I realise that this is quite a serious issue, as most catholics I have encountered have told me that even if one lives a life of piety and goodness in faith outside the Catholic Church, I will go to hell.

On the one hand, I have the same problems with the Catholic Church as most Protestants have had over many centuries. I question the doctrine of papal infallabilty, due to the corruptible nature of man. I question the perceived ability of priests to forgive sins, as I struggle to believe that anyone bar the Lord has the power to forgive sins. I also struggle to believe in the notion of ‘no salvation outside the one church’, as the idea of good and faithful Protestants going to hell, including my own family, seems unpalatable and unacceptable.

Maybe I just don’t have the information, but I know this is quite the catholic board, so feel free to give your case and clear up any misconceptions you think I might have.

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65dcab  No.785749

>>785745

No, they couldn't atone for their sins without the sacrifice made by a priest, who had to go through the veil of the temple to do the sacrifice.

>>785744

Jesus wouldn't give them authority higher than His own, they may have some authority from Him but He holds the ultimate authority, and we can ask Him for forgiveness because He hears our prayers.


025dcc  No.785752

>>785749

>Jesus wouldn't give them authority higher than His own

now you're going into extra-biblical exegesis, the authority to hear confessions progresses from Christ and His authority, and we know very well that anyone who rejects His Apostles rejects Him.

>He holds the ultimate authority, and we can ask Him for forgiveness because He hears our prayers.

And Christ, in His ultimate authority, gave it to His Apostles, and gave them the sole charge to hear and forgive the sins of the people. The only other extra-apostolic forgiveness of sins comes through to us in a valid baptism.


06ec2f  No.785754

Fast forward 500 years after the Reformation and you get Tupac singing "Only God can judge me."

That's the result of all of this. You guys made the church impotent in people's lives. Good job (not).


08437b  No.785765

>>785744

>Then why did Christ give His authorities charge to hear confessions?

Read Matthew 18:15-17 and Matthew 18:19-20. It's about church discipline and the leadership having the right to make the final decision about the church's stance with regards to a person. Matthew 18:18 objectively has nothing to do with confessions.

Meanwhile, 1 John 1:9 says "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

So the verse to go to for confessions is 1 John 1:9. Also James 5:16 says confess your faults one to another. Not the same as sins. 1 John 1:9 handles confessing sins, it is to be done to the Jesus Christ the Son.

>>785745

>So what you're saying is that the OT jews couldn't pray? LOL

I thought we were talking about confessions and forgiveness of sins. In the OT they had to offer burnt sacrifices by the levitical priest. In the NT we go through Jesus Christ the high priest after the order of Melchisedec.

Again, Matthew 18:18 has nothing to do with confessions (there is no mention of it) or with God forgiving sins. It has to do with whether the church body will forgive something or not. And like it says in Matthew 18:21-22,

Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?

Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.

>>785746

>how do you explain Jesus giving his Apostles the right to bind and loose and forgive sins?

It's church discipline exactPost too long. Click here to view the full text.


025dcc  No.785768

>>785765

The Apostles and their successors ARE the Church leadership. And this Church has always maintained the sacrament of confession, even the after the Schism.

>1 John 1:9 says "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

and to whom do we confess our sins too? this self-same Apostle was given the mission to hear and forgive sins, you cannot find me anywhere in scripture where this charge was dissolved.

>1 John 1:9 handles confessing sins, it is to be done to the Jesus Christ the Son

Jesus Christ, true man and true God, who gave the authority to hear and forgive sins to His Apostles and their successors.

You have not proved your point at all.

>Now you are even denying 1 John 1:9 which I just quoted above.

1 John 1:9 does not address the your interpretation of the sacrament of confession ever being absolved, but rather, all confession must be done through the authority of Jesus Christ.

Hello! Which He gave to His Apostles! He breathed the Holy Spirit upon them, what was that? Just for fun? They even got visited a second time after Christ was assumed into Heaven!




File: 16eb9de436ebc8f⋯.jpg (45.24 KB, 474x330, 79:55, problem of evil.jpg)

d48849  No.785683[Reply]

After the mosque shooting, some of my atheist friends have debated with me about the classic problem of evil, as in why an all-loving GOD allows what appears to be unnecessary suffering, and I'm curious as to how to approach this issue without having said friends become hardened from the glory of GOD.

9 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

e1e74e  No.785756

A classic problem with a classic answer. Ever hear of Boethius?


5f65b4  No.785758

>>785740

>I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Isaiah 45:7


c7760e  No.785763

Nothing evil about dead Muslims. I'd say this is more of a breath of fresh air than anything. winnie the pooh those sandtiggers


28e82f  No.785766


2f3989  No.785767

>>785726

Thread/




File: df33d5a2079965f⋯.jpg (3.64 KB, 616x357, 88:51, b77fe464cfc445da9003a5383a….jpg)

0bd8a8  No.785476[Reply]

Sup 8chan.

I am a Catholic and a senior in high school at the moment, and have been trying to figure out what on earth to do with my life beyond graduation. Since I was quite young my family has pushed the usual "major in engineering at the best university possible, make 100k plus a year and have two kids" stuff on me, as expected. In a quite unasked for series of events, I have found myself very apathetic towards the idea. I do not really WANT to live my life amassing money and being depressed in a country club like my father did. I have examined other routes to take, but have found similar problems with them.

I have had this nagging feeling in the back of my mind that I should look into a life with the Church. I do not know if I am being called to the priesthood or something of the sort, and no part of me has ever particularly been drawn towards a life based solely on religion until this year. Yet I still have that draw dragging me towards a life involved with religion over a more typical life.

I do feel reluctance towards further examining and committing to life in some vocation stemming from one source. I AM AN ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE HUMAN BEING. I go to confession weekly, sometimes more if I can. I have been futilely struggling with the same few sins for years on end and I am not in the slightest bit worthy to even begin thinking of leading a religiously bound life.

SO, in summary, "What do?"

7 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

f30e38  No.785505

>>785479

>but NEEDING to go to confession is a bad sign. It means I am in a constant state of sin

Dude, unless you are some sort of ultra mega super saint, this is the normal state of the average Christian, period, even if they are not lukewarm. Even priests have other priests that they go and confess to.


0b64aa  No.785592

>>785479

You are saved by grace; not filthy rags. Do good for goodness sake not because you fear God and want to buy a way into heaven. To stop sinning try forming habits, alternative activities (inactivity can lead quickly to sin), and pray about it. I find myself in a similar position to you in that I'm naturally suited to be an engineer, but I am currently taking it. This field is not for people that are looking for only money, but who want an intellectually stimulating job and to be productive. So if you pass it off as materialism don't use anything that an engineer makes then.


2b15e8  No.785608

>Since I was quite young my family has pushed the usual "major in engineering at the best university possible, make 100k plus a year and have two kids" stuff on me

I can relate; I'm studying computer science right now because everyone in my family wants me to, and I'm uninterested in it and doing the bare minimum to get by, learning very little in the process. Meanwhile, I spend most of my free time reading the Bible and Christian books, studying the history of Christianity, researching and discussing various Christian topics with other Christians, etc.. Assuming college works out and I can find a job (highly doubtful), I'd be stuck working 9a-5p in an office with soy boys and foreigners from India and Thailand for the next 30+ years, which would be miserable. I'm thinking of majoring in Theology instead, however I wouldn't want to become a priest, as I strongly desire a wife and kids. What Catholic job opportunities would that leave me with? The position of Deacon and teaching Theology are the only ones I'm aware of, which would be all right (other than the fact I'd have to attend many years of schooling until I'm in my 30s, but at least it's a field I enjoy studying).


35f58d  No.785688

>>785608

School usually kills interest in a topic. Do interesting CS projects on the side to see if you like it, or drop out. It will be very difficult to find a job or stay there very long if you don't. It's funny how much Catholics here hate Martin Luther but have so much in common with his early life. The truth will set you free. A song about it: https://youtu.be/a6Huy7Fonv4

God bless.


ca0eeb  No.785759

>>785476

Be a STEM major and make six figures.




File: bd9c5d6b4f46fdf⋯.jpg (47.7 KB, 800x800, 1:1, Spidur.jpg)

011b55  No.785699[Reply]

I don't know how many autistic people actually post in this particular board, but I feel a need to ask. As someone with autism, how on Earth am I supposed to be comfortable, or even content, when it comes to practicing Christianity? I can do stuff like pray and read the bible, but stuff like going to church or confession make me a nervous wreck because I don't like dealing with big crowds or singing or just badly following along what everyone else is doing. It doesn't help that I'm constantly asking myself if I'm following the right sect of Christianity. I understand it started with Martin Luther, but I keep asking myself if following the wrong sect of Christianity is worse than not being religious at all? Autistic people on average do well with set goals/actions, and when there's so many different possibilities to not just the sects, but to the meanings of different parts of the bible, some of which conflict, that I start having panic attacks thinking about it. Don't even get me started on the parts about converting people, I've been told that I'd be a terrible motivational speaker.

4 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

899cda  No.785720

>>785716

I don't know why it corrected biblically to bionically, but my dyslexia made me not notice until now…


011b55  No.785725

>>785712

It's high functioning, but I get real uncomfortable real quick in situations with a lot of noise and people. By the end of a few church sessions I'm shaking a bit because I wanted to get out of the crowd.

>>785716

It's not whether I feel which one feels right, it's whether one is correct. I've always been told not to make assumptions, and assuming one is right and basing my whole belief around it scares me something fierce, especially if it's wrong.

>>785717

Good works like what?


d99f7a  No.785728

>>785716

>>785699

But inevitably, Christian traditions are supposed to foster community and personal development, since God is love and also one must store up treasures in heaven. So even if you take a monastic route, that doesn't mean that you won't have to challenge autistic tendencies. After all, you are basically giving yourself over to a lifetime of community service, it's not like you will be spared the hardship of communicating because you're the autistic monk.


d99f7a  No.785734

>>785725

Good works;

>Improving your health (you are a temple of the Holy Spirit)

>Abstaining from immoral habits (porn is mostly cited here, but getting hammered/drunk is also a sin)

>Helping others in general

>Prayer

>Community service, if you are into it

And these next two, that I fear to tell an autistic religious person, for reasons I will elaborate;

>Almsgiving (but not in excess)

>Fasting (but not in excess)

I know you've said you're autistic, so try not to do anything that is excessive/harmful to yourself or your finances. Autistic people should be afraid of themselves in this regard; I knew a young girl who nearly starved herself fasting. She was such a wonderful person, but completely autistic. Please therefore, don't do anything where you think you could bring it to a point of self-destructive excess, doing so would be against self-love, self-love is the requisite foundation of all other love so you are NOT to repeat the heresy of the flagellants 700 years after the fact by self-harming. Please.


ab819d  No.785753

>>785725

First of all, and most importantly, listen to this anon: >>785734

Secondly, to address your OP question, watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbDsxw-e0m3mIkapUEZ_-5BEOr19F4t73




File: ae1b3a2d4f118fe⋯.jpg (41.24 KB, 600x399, 200:133, cross-at-sunrise-600x399.jpg)

3af386  No.785441[Reply]

I have a friend who believes in the "God doesn't give you more than you can handle" meme. What would you say to such a person?

4 posts and 1 image reply omitted. Click reply to view.

ebc556  No.785701

>>785441

I'd say he's correct, though I wouldn't necessarily word it the way he does. I'd probably evoke the example of Job more than anything else. Suffering isn't inherently bad, nor is it a sign that god has abandoned you or that you've sinned. If you've sin is punished only if committed willfully, and even then not always.

I dislike the phrasing there because it could be misinterpreted to effectively blame God for your misery, which is the opposite of what you should do in a time of suffering. Suffering is a time to turn to God for consolation, not away from him out of bitterness. Trust me, it was in a time of serious mental/emotional darkness that I began my conversion and that was after reading Job which is still easily my favorite book of the OT… I remember crying at the end. God doesn't allow you (or mankind in general) to suffer so that you might turn away from him, but that you may turn towards him.


578bcf  No.785706

>>785701

I have a really hard time with the book of Job. I get the lesson that it's trying to convey, but it's impossible for me to read it (assuming it is literal rather than allegory) as anything other than one guy being made miserable for the purposes of settling a casual bar bet between supernatural beings.

I know that sounds like edgy athiestposting, but damn. If my wife and kids died, a new wife and kids wouldn't smooth over the death of my family.


c00aa9  No.785709

>>785706

>as anything other than one guy being made miserable for the purposes of settling a casual bar bet between supernatural beings

"Many look upon the entire contents of the book as a freely invented parable which is neither historical nor intended to be considered historical; no such man as Job ever lived. Catholic commentators, however, almost without exception, hold Job to have actually existed and his personality to have been preserved by popular tradition. Nothing in the text makes it necessary to doubt his historical existence. The Scriptures seem repeatedly to take this for granted (cf. Ezekiel 14:14; James 5:11; Tobit 2:12-15, according to the Vulgate — in the Greek text of Tobias there is no mention of Job). All the Fathers considered Job an historical person; some of their testimonies may be found in Knabenbauer, "Zu Job" (Paris, 1886), 12-13. The Martyrology of the Latin Church mentions Job on 10 May, that of the Greek Church on 6 May (cf. Acta SS.' II, May, 494). The Book of Job, therefore, has a kernel of fact, with which have been united many imaginative additions that are not strictly historical. What is related by the poet in the prose prologue and epilogue is in the main historical: the persons of the hero and his friends; the region where be lived; his good fortune and virtues; the great misfortune that overwhelmed him and the patience with which he bore it; the restoration of his Prosperity. It is also to be accepted that Job and his friends discussed the origin of his sufferings, and that in so doing views were expressed similar to those the poet puts into the mouths of his characters. The details of the execution, the poetic form, and the art shown in the arrangement of the arguments in the dispute are, however, the free creation of the author. The figures expressive of the wealth of Job both before and after his trial are imaginatively rounded. Also in the narrative of the misfortunes it is impossible not to recognize a poetic conception which need not be considered as strictly historical. The scene in heaven (i, 6; ii, 1) is plainly an allegory which shows that the Providence of God guides the destiny of man (cf. St. Thomas, "In Job"). The manifestation of God (xxxviii, 1) generally receives a literal interpretaPost too long. Click here to view the full text.


6f9126  No.785750

>>785499

I'm saying God doesn't make mistakes.


5b36f4  No.785751

That he's wrong and the Buy Bull is a crock of vile Jew bullshit.




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1fe89f  No.785647[Reply]

Re-making this thread since the last one died recently

The Gospel

>1 Corinthians 15:1-4__

"Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

>Romans 10:9-10__

"That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

Baptist Confessions, and Statements

London Baptist Confession of 1689 (Calvinist): http://www.ccel.org/ccel/anonymous/bcf.pdf

Baptist Faith and Message (Arminian Inclusive): http://www.sbc.net/bfm2000/bfm2000.asp

Notable Modern Baptist Teachers

Albert Mohler: https://albertmohler.com/

James White: https://www.youtube.com/user/AominOrg

John Piper: https://www.desiringgod.org/

Leighton Flowers: Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

4 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

706e13  No.785692

How does one reconcile the Once Saved Always Saved docrine?

I always hear people trashing on Baptists because of the faith alone and OSAS - They say that both of these allow you to sin as much as you want without fear because you're going to heaven anyways.


1fe89f  No.785705

>>785692

Those people don't understand once saved always saved and faith alone so they make a strawman of it. They think that it's enough to just say "yeah I believe God exists" and then you're saved forever no matter how much you sin, but that's not it at all. Even demons believe that God is real, and they even fear Him, but they don't have faith in Him which is the difference. To have faith in God is to trust Him with your life, and to follow what He says. I always like to explain it using the parachute analogy: you have to believe the parachute exists, then you have to put it on, then you have to have faith that the parachute will save you from the fall, but after you have faith in it and you make the jump, you have to pull the cord like the parachute tells you. If you don't pull the cord (repent and turn from sin), then the parachute (the Lord) won't save you. Once you have faith in God, and you put your life in His hands, you are saved. You become a new creature in Christ, and though you aren't perfect you're now His, He has saved you. Sure, you might slip up and sin every now and then, but right away you'll apologize, you'll repent and feel terribly sorry for your sin, and you'll try your absolute best to not do it again. A degenerate person who is not saved feels no shame for their sins, they gladly fornicate and lie and steal and blaspheme and etc. As Romans 5:1 tells us, "Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ", which shows us that we are saved by faith, and that we can have peace with God knowing that we are saved. 1 John 5:13 tells us "that you may know that you have eternal life", which is proof that we can know that we are saved, we don't need to work away in fear that we aren't good enough for God.


706e13  No.785707

>>785705

>repent of your sins

This is another topic that is widely debated as well. I hear that repenting of your sins is considered works salvation.


1fe89f  No.785715

>>785707

Repentance is not what saves you, it is what shows your faith. The baptist view of salvation is that we put our faith in God, and if our faith is a saving faith it will manifest good works, but the works are not what saves us. Good works are the outward sign that our faith is a saving faith, but it is our faith that saves us. Abraham is a great example of this, as it's mentioned in both the old testament and the new testament that he was saved because of his faith in God, not in any acts that he may have done as a sign that he had faith in God.


f0e02a  No.785748

>>785715

Yep, and James 2 completes the circle on this perfectly because the outward works justified Abraham before men, whereas according to Romans 4:5, faith justifies and saves before God.

James 2:14-26 is about showing another man your faith by works in order to save him. That's why it asks can your faith save him. Can your faith save him or will you have to make it manifest is what verses 14-17 get into, and James 2:18 and onward is about how Abraham shows to us his faith by his works.

So these actions play a part in getting others saved, but faith is what justifies before God. See also 1 Corinthians 4:

1 Corinthians 4:1-4

Let a man so account of us, as of the ministers of Christ, and stewards of the mysteries of God. Moreover it is required in stewards, that a man be found faithful.

But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self. For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.




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5aae12  No.785429[Reply]

So, I posted something similar on reddit, but I want to pool as many ideas on this topic as possible. If we refer to Romans 13, we get a simple rubric for legitimate princes that we should pay tribute to. However, if a prince does not follow this rubric, then they cease to be a legitimate authority, and it seems as though we are not supposed to support such a government. A legitimate prince can even be rapidly narrowed with one verse:

Romans 13:3 — "For princes are not a terror to the good work, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? Do that which is good: and thou shalt have praise from the same."

So if a prince is a terror to good works, then they are not actual princes, and therefore, have no legitimate authority from God to govern us. Here is where it gets a bit complicated. In Luke 23:2, we are told of the claims against Christ by the Jews: "And they began to accuse him, saying: We have found this man perverting our nation, and forbidding to give tribute to Caesar, and saying that he is Christ the king." This is a triad of accusations that is unique to the Gospel of Luke, and it is strange to find because at least two of the accusations are true. It is true that Christ perverted the nation of Rome from its pagan ways, and it is also true that Christ is our King. So I am left thinking why it also would not be true that they found Jesus forbidding them to give tribute to Caesar.

The concept of the morality of paying income tax to illegitimate princes is made even less clear with Matthew 22:21-22, which is when the Pharisees and Herodians entreat Jesus to hear whether it is lawful to pay tribute to Caesar or not: "They say to him: Caesar's. Then he saith to them: Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar's; and to God, the things that are God's. And hearing this they wondered, and leaving him, went their ways." Why would the Pharisees and Herodians "wonder" at this statement if it should be a clear proof of paying taxes to Caesar? Furthermore, if the Pharisees took this as proof that you should pay income tax, then they would have accused Jesus of idolatry immediately. Jews were not supposed to pay tribute with coins bearing graven images back then. They wouldn't "wonder" and then walk away.

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7c8a34  No.785620

>>785618

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2010/03/jeffrey-f-barr/render-unto-caesar-amostmisunderstood-newtestamentpassage/

>Llewellyn Harrison Rockwell Jr. (born July 1, 1944) is an American author, editor, and political consultant. A libertarian and a self-professed anarcho-capitalist,[1] he founded (and is chairman of) the Ludwig von Mises Institute, a non-profit dedicated to promoting the Austrian School of economics. He also started a website in 1999, LewRockwell.com, that features articles and blog entries by a number of right-wing libertarian columnists and writers.

So, yeah, it's the "pure meaning of the" Bible, as seen by ancaps.


5aae12  No.785629

>>785620

That is a patently absurd position to hold because of Romans 13. We can have good princes, and we are ordered to pay tribute to them. It is impossible for every single government to be bad. Otherwise, the monarchical Catholic Church would be bad, which it is not.

I also don't see how you can extract crap like like plagues being a reflection of the Egyptian pantheon or whatever. The miracles of the Bible are hardly able to be understood by anyone. I am talking about hard evidence of a Jewish audience bringing claims against Jesus that would have been a sin against the 8th commandment to falsely testify against. Jewish people not lying is not equivalent to the miracle of Jesus walking on water. You're stretching your argument.


fbe3be  No.785630

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

Some things are commonly accepted as Biblical.


af87a2  No.785648

>>785616

>>785620

You're merely asserting that the anarcho capitalist political view is wrong, and then that this presupposition informs the argument. You need to first argue why mises style libertarianism is wrong biblically, then make the connection to the argument, or you need to argue against the article on it's face.

tl;dr not an argument


5aae12  No.785741

And well, I seem to have found a clean-cut case to end this discussion. I was unaware of this paragraph in the CCC (Catechism of the Catholic Church) until now:

2242 The citizen is obliged in conscience not to follow the directives of civil authorities when they are contrary to the demands of the moral order, to the fundamental rights of persons or the teachings of the Gospel. Refusing obedience to civil authorities, when their demands are contrary to those of an upright conscience, finds its justification in the distinction between serving God and serving the political community. "Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's."48 "We must obey God rather than men"

So now we have to wonder why civil disobedience has be kept quiet among our clergy. Oh well, thanks for your opinions.




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